You can't evolve turn one. So all I see is the turn one attack being delayed till turn two. Like i said, it helps out but its not the "OMG EVERYONE IS PLAYING STAGE 2 NOW" kind of thing. The way I see it, people will still play the speed(or more consistent) decks which generally don't have stage 2. Blastoise decks works b/c of Trocipal Beach and and Black Kyurem EX.
Rogue Deck Discussion
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In regards to Tropical Beach, have you noticed the price increase for this card since the announcement of the pending rule changes? I know a player who sold his 3 Tropical Beaches for well over $500 - that's just crazy (especially crazy good for him). But, not being able to attack as the T1 player is having some interesting effects...
Thinking about combining Machamp (50 & 51) PLB along with Blastoise BDC. It'd be plenty of fun knocking out the competition with a completely non-EX Deck, and with the new first-turn-no-attack rule, and Catcher's errata, it SEEMS doable but... 2 Stage 2's is just too much effort. It was doable with Junk Arm back in the HGSS days, but not now!
There should be a separate thread here called Tier Reshiboar crap decks instead of having this thread clogged up with those
decks imho.
This is known as Competitive Play for a reason
~Camoclone
Rogue decks are decks that can legitimately compete with tier 1 decks and they are little-known decks.
Anywho, I thought of a deck that would beat the predicted Plasma and Stoise meta for Philly Seniors Regionals. Now, I've decided on a different deck and I don't even know if I'm going to philly regionals, which is why i decided to share this.
Here's the key cards:
4-4 Zoroark BLW/NXD
3 Mewtwo EX
2 Absol PLF
1 Mr. Mime PLF
3 Dark Claw
4 Dark Patch
It has like even to slightly unfavorable matchups against VirGen and DarkGarb. It is mainly designed to beat Plasma and Blastoise. Zoroark with a Dark Claw gets powered up much easier with just one energy attachment (DCE) and can OHKO Kyurem, making it a very effective counter. Absol also typically dishes out huge amounts of damage against Plasma for just two energy. Against Blastoise, Zoroark makes an easy two prizes out of any Black Kyurem EX, and Mewtwo can handle Keldeo EXs quite well. Mr. Mime helps prevent opponents from setting up KOs (obviously).
decks imho.
This is known as Competitive Play for a reason
~CamocloneRogue decks are decks that can legitimately compete with tier 1 decks and they are little-known decks.
Anywho, I thought of a deck that would beat the predicted Plasma and Stoise meta for Philly Seniors Regionals. Now, I've decided on a different deck and I don't even know if I'm going to philly regionals, which is why i decided to share this.
Here's the key cards:
4-4 Zoroark BLW/NXD
3 Mewtwo EX
2 Absol PLF
1 Mr. Mime PLF
3 Dark Claw
4 Dark Patch
It has like even to slightly unfavorable matchups against VirGen and DarkGarb. It is mainly designed to beat Plasma and Blastoise. Zoroark with a Dark Claw gets powered up much easier with just one energy attachment (DCE) and can OHKO Kyurem, making it a very effective counter. Absol also typically dishes out huge amounts of damage against Plasma for just two energy. Against Blastoise, Zoroark makes an easy two prizes out of any Black Kyurem EX, and Mewtwo can handle Keldeo EXs quite well. Mr. Mime helps prevent opponents from setting up KOs (obviously).
So as far as rogue decks go, I've been experimenting with a hard counter deck to the meta, it's esencially a toolbox deck but it needs a lot of work. The pokemon list goes along these lines,
2 Landorus EX
2 Terrakian EX
3 Victini EX
3 Genesect PLB
2-2 Garbodor
Usual supporter line
4 Fighting Energy
2 Fire Energy
2 Grass Energy
4 Prisism Energy
It's still pretty clunky but when you can get a T1 Victini EX onto Terrakian EX and continue to pump up smash from then on its a lot of fun.
2 Landorus EX
2 Terrakian EX
3 Victini EX
3 Genesect PLB
2-2 Garbodor
Usual supporter line
4 Fighting Energy
2 Fire Energy
2 Grass Energy
4 Prisism Energy
It's still pretty clunky but when you can get a T1 Victini EX onto Terrakian EX and continue to pump up smash from then on its a lot of fun.
That seems like it can do some damage when it gets set up... A lot of damage! However as you said before it is pretty clunky meaning it won't get set up that fast very often. Due to that most competitive decks can just out-speed you. Kyurem with a turn 1 Frost-Spear would just wreck your Victini EX. A turn-2 Blastoise could take out your Victini EX's. Another problem would be your weaknesses.Cortel II said:
Victini EX: Kyurem, Keldeo
Landorous EX: Kyurem Keldeo
Terrakion EX: Genesect
These weaknesses just aren't favorable. You would have to be very careful with your benching. I feel that your strongest matchup would be Darkrai by far. However, I would much rather run something like this:
-3 Cobalion EX
-3 Mewtwo EX
-3 Landorous EX
-2-2 Garbodor
Something like that can beat: TDK, Blastoise, and Darkrai pretty well. I can see what your deck was getting at however I just feel it's too slow
. +1 for using Terrakion EX though I've always wanted to find a use for that card in this format. It might be good with the new rules though due the meta slowing down and catcher leaving the competitive scene.I was originally testing out a rogue deck, Latias EX, Sigilyph, and Victini EX for acceleration, but I found it wasn't putting out enough damage. I recently modified it to Chandalure EX and Entei EX, with Lazerbanks, and keeping Latias EX and Victini EX. It gives a LOT of status disruptions, and they add up. Fast. Starting with Victini guarantees a T2 attack on any of your big hitters.
Thoughts on this combo? Improvements or potential issues you could see?
Thoughts on this combo? Improvements or potential issues you could see?
Hackurs said:
T2.... too bad you cant attack turn 1 starting tomorrow
AlexanderTheAwesome said:
You're assuming that I go first. Even if I do, it's only a slight delay of one turn and the setup speed can overcome that, once the status conditions are in effect. Besides, it seems to me like most people playing blastoise or other stage 2 decks will want to go first, so that would work in my favor as well.
camoclone said:
I wouldn't be too concerned with with your Weakness since they're covered by other Pokemon in the deck. You can even throw in Iron Breaker Cobalions to counter Kyurems. It wouldn't be clunky at all without the Garbodors. This deck was definitely a force to be reckoned with before the rule change. After the rule change, I'm not entirely sure how bad it hurts the deck, but it certainly doesn't help this deck achieve its goal.
Blah said:
I think you can do it on ptcgo. Not that that has any effect on the ruling; just saying.
So, I've been having a bit of success with Garchomp recently. Silver Bangle lets you 2HKO just about everything, and Mirrorz + Mr. Mime makes it difficult for Plasma to do much against you. It also appreciates the new rules and the Catcher errata. I feel like for the first time ever, it's actually almost good... for a rogue, of course.
There has been a deck I've been toying around with, and the primary focus is the new Gallade from Legendary Treasures. The second attack has monstrous output when played right.
My main Pokemon line-up is:
3-3 Gallade (Legendary Treasures)
2-2 Reuniclus (it has Damage Swap)
2x Kyurem EX (PLB)
2x Ditto
The results are mixed. When it works, it really works out! If it doesn't its mostly a thud for the most part, and its a shame because I personally love this idea of a deck. It doesn't help the Solosis have 30 HP, which is the worst thing to have on Bench with no Mr. Mime out. I have also tried different Pokemon out to see what works and what doesn't. Landorus with Gaia Hammer is an alright alternative, but you have to start with him first turn and Abundant Harvest only works for him. Excadrill EX is risky because of the discarding from the deck, which I tried with Lunatone with Premonition to see how it went...its not good in my opinion. Pokedex is the only way to ensure yourself an extra energy placement. What are ya's thoughts on this kind of deck? Any suggestions to make it better?
My main Pokemon line-up is:
3-3 Gallade (Legendary Treasures)
2-2 Reuniclus (it has Damage Swap)
2x Kyurem EX (PLB)
2x Ditto
The results are mixed. When it works, it really works out! If it doesn't its mostly a thud for the most part, and its a shame because I personally love this idea of a deck. It doesn't help the Solosis have 30 HP, which is the worst thing to have on Bench with no Mr. Mime out. I have also tried different Pokemon out to see what works and what doesn't. Landorus with Gaia Hammer is an alright alternative, but you have to start with him first turn and Abundant Harvest only works for him. Excadrill EX is risky because of the discarding from the deck, which I tried with Lunatone with Premonition to see how it went...its not good in my opinion. Pokedex is the only way to ensure yourself an extra energy placement. What are ya's thoughts on this kind of deck? Any suggestions to make it better?
The Sawk I never thought about, that is pretty neat as a tech. How is the Excadrill-EX working out for you? My time with it, it was discarding important cards like Supporters. I guess that is just the luck aspect of such a card...
TheElite711 said:
There IS a chance of that happening, but right now I'm playing without Excadrills(haven't found any here yet) and with 3 Landorus and a 3-1 split of the LTR Gallade and the PLS one, it has worked for me, since I can discard energy with Ultra Ball and such and them Harvest them to attack faster. But with Excadrill, the time I tested it on PlayTCG the damage output was outstanding, so I'm willing to make a 2-2 Landorus/Excadrill split.
I might go back and try Landorus again considering it had some success on my playtesting. It does have Silver Bangle support, and that makes it great against a Big Techs deck, one shotting Victini EX and then spreads the damage around for Gallade to swing in hard against Terrakion EX or something.
Now that Catcher is nerfed, Bench-sitting Pokemon purported to use their Ability have a higher chance of staying healthfully on the field! We'll probably see more Reuniclus BW/DRX, or even Celebi EX as a result!
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