TCG One TCG ONE General Discussion

RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Whatever measure is taken, don't tell the public or it will be circumvented. Just make sure something is done against people found doing it before it drives the price of everything up. (plus it just not being fair in general)
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Hi all

I have read your coments. I dont know as much about pokemon sets and decks as tash and other players but i have played lots of tcgs and here my suggestions:

-Ban removals so high evolution and a wider range of decks can be played, not only haymakers/blastoise/wigglituff/Mime and veteran players dont overpower that much. (everyone i talked to agrees on banning them)

-Change the store. New players find hard to know they can buy boosters/decks searching "store". Even I realised yesterday there was decks with removals.

-Make 2 matching options: close level players +/-10lvls. Any player.

-Bits rewards when getting a higher level to get new players engaged and make it easier to acquire cards at the beggining (written somewhere so they know there is a reward).

Well as you might see these are simple things but i believe they will help a lot. As soon there is 10 average players, those new people that logs in and cant find a match or just play a frustrating match with a veteran will stay and there will be a bigger community ^^

If you find new people, try to help them. I think we can also help doing what he proposed us, designing decks. Just give me details and i will make some ^^

By the way, another cause people dont keep playing is connection problems. I am not the best to talk about this cause sometimes i cant load any website for a strange DNS problem i am still unable to solve. However, i just want to say that people complain about lag and loading red square and i get best performance with mozilla. With chrome and explorer i cant finish most matches because of disconnections. I downloaded mozilla and used it cause a player told me he didnt have problems with it.

At last, just say that a drafting tournament would be something really epic xD I really like the idea but as many of other suggestions, yes, needs more people playing.

Thats all!
PD: Ax remember to reverse the thing about electrode xD Now it doesnt provide energy card
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

This banning/not banning Removals question is pretty strange. On one hand, I think we all agree they're too good. On the other, they never got banned when these sets were active in the TCG. I'm really conflicted on which I'd rather have, but I'm not going to complain either way. I'm using them so much myself because I don't want to end up being at a huge disadvantage against other people with them more than just wanting to dominate people though, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

On Electrode: I know I brought the original problem up, but if I have to choose between Electrode then and now, I'm reverting it to then. If it's somehow feasible to fix both problems then sure, do that, but Electrode is a total pain to deal with I'm sure (the official Pokemon TCG video game didn't include it because of coding problems!) so if reverting is more feasible I'm all for it.

I take it you want the new starter decks made for just Gym Heroes? I poked around with the cards in it and it's hard to make decks that don't look like the existing theme decks but I'll try.

I also really hope you're going to end up restocking the Base Set packs since they're getting low. It won't hurt me too much since I got a bunch of those cards already, but it's currently really unfair to the new players to have limited packs at nearly twice the bits of other packs. I'm not sure what you mean by being able to buy single cards soon so can you explain that? I think I might be misunderstanding how this is about to work, though I'm still not too for this 200 bits for a pack thing.

Despite that last complaint I really do appreciate what you're doing here, don't get me wrong. I've wanted a site like this for a long time and I can finally play with old cards with people online.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

As for ER, I think it's best to just leave them be and hope we get alternate formats without it soon. Otherwise, it sets a bad precedent for banning in the future. (if you think ER is bad, wait until we get to the point where one person manages to pull a cleffa early and it ends up being so rare nobody else can)
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Yeah I really hope Cleffa isn't made rarer than it normally was, because it's pretty much required for decks from that era. It would give people a chance to keep up.

Anyway, Cleffa isn't the reason for this post. I worked a bit and came up with some Gym Heroes deck ideas, though it was pretty hard working with a pool of just 132 cards. I tried to give the decks mostly decent cards with a couple of drawing options (though Gym drawing is weak) while avoiding the few really good things in the set. I decided not to completely base these on gyms and instead go with two-type decks to make them a bit different than the theme decks. I have no idea for names so any suggestions on that and the deck contents would be nice.


Grass/Lightning

Pokemon: 22

3 Erika's Oddish #78
3 Erika's Gloom #45
1 Erika's Vileplume
2 Lt. Surge's Pikachu
1 Lt. Surge's Raichu
2 Brock's Zubat #74
2 Brock's Golbat
2 Erika's Exeggcute #77
2 Erika's Exeggutor
2 Lt. Surge's Rattata
2 Lt. Surge's Raticate

Trainers: 20

1 Lt. Surge
1 Celadon City Gym
2 Erika's Maids
2 Good Manners
2 Misty's Wrath
2 Secret Mission
2 Blaine's Gamble
2 Energy Flow
2 Narrow Gym
2 Sabrina's Gaze
2 Trash Exchange

Energy: 18

11 Grass
7 Lightning


Water/Fighting

Pokemon: 22

2 Brock's Rhyhorn #70
1 Brock's Rhydon
3 Misty's Poliwag
2 Misty's Poliwhirl
1 Misty's Poliwrath
2 Brock's Geodude #66
2 Brock's Graveler
2 Brock's Lickitung
3 Misty's Goldeen #85
3 Misty's Seaking
1 Brock's Mankey #67

Trainers: 20

1 Brock
2 Brock's Training Method
1 Cerulean City Gym
2 Misty's Wrath
2 Recall
2 Secret Mission
2 Blaine's Gamble
2 Energy Flow
2 Narrow Gym
2 Sabrina's Gaze
2 Trash Exchange

Energy: 18

11 Water
7 Fighting


Fire/Psychic

Pokemon: 22

2 Lt. Surge's Spearow #52
1 Lt. Surge's Fearow
3 Sabrina's Gastly
2 Sabrina's Haunter
1 Sabrina's Gengar
1 Blaine's Magmar
2 Sabrina's Jynx
2 Sabrina's Slowpoke
2 Sabrina's Slowbro
2 Blaine's Charmander
2 Blaine's Tauros
2 Sabrina's Mr. Mime

Trainers: 20

1 The Rocket's Training Gym
1 Blaine's Last Resort
2 Misty's Wrath
2 Minion of Team Rocket
2 Secret Mission
2 Tickling Machine
2 Blaine's Gamble
2 Energy Flow
2 Narrow Gym
2 Sabrina's Gaze
2 Trash Exchange

Energy: 18

7 Fire
11 Psychic
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Are you trying to kill us all? Rocket's Moltres is probably a card best left out of starter decks. It's a lot stronger than it looks. I once entered a tournament where half of the players were running it

Also, a lot of base-rocket powers are stopped by poison when they shouldn't be. It wasn't until the e-card sets that poison started disabling powers.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Erika can be replaced by something else (Maybe Lt. Surge?) if it seems like too much. Out of every card listed in the 3 decks, it was that Erika spot I had the most trouble with.

I'm really surprised half of the players ran Rocket's Moltres at a tournament where you are, though I know it's underrated by most people. I wanted something Fire up there and Blaine's Moltres seemed like it would take forever to get going. Maybe it can be replaced by a Colorless evolution. Something like:

+2 Lt. Surge's Spearow #52
+1 Lt. Surge's Fearow
+1 Psychic Energy

-1 Rocket's Moltres
-1 Sabrina's Haunter
-1 Blaine's Magmar
-1 Fire Energy

Edit: Decided to change to that for now, it's probably better that way.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

snowpointsecret said:
I'm really surprised half of the players ran Rocket's Moltres at a tournament where you are, though I know it's underrated by most people.
I can't speak for all places, but around here it was one of those decks that controlled the metagame for a while, then promptly disappeared when the next set was released (like Reshiphlosian). I really wish I could remember what it was run with, though. I have zero memory of what the rest of the deck looked like.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Poison should not disable Pokémon Powers yet. This makes Pokémon such as Fossil Magmar vastly overpowered (Mr. Mime and Alakazam have been rendered nearly useless).

This has probably been mentioned already a few times, but Jungle Eevee's Tail Wag still prevents both(?) players from attaching Energy cards.

When I use Gengar's Curse on a Machamp, Strikes Back activates. I don't think that's supposed to happen (Curse isn't an attack).

Fossil Haunter's Transparency is supposed to block all effects of attacks, including damage. While a Lightning Flash from my opponent's Dark Jolteon was rendered useless damage-wise, I still had to flip a coin in order to attack in the next turn.

Add an "ignore user" feature when it comes to chatting. I'm sorry to say, I was hoping we wouldn't ever need one, but I really would rather not see the messages of a number of users here already. In particular, users that cannot handle losing, users who are too young for me to want to speak to, and, most importantly, people who harass me based on my play-style. Because my deck has a lot of depth, and requires a lot of thinking in order to use properly, I take a little longer to play. A number of users have been harassing me simply because of that, and I'd just like to shut down their whining. I'm just here to play the game, not listen to little kids whine.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Verbatim said:
Add an "ignore user" feature when it comes to chatting. I'm sorry to say, I was hoping we wouldn't ever need one, but I really would rather not see the messages of a number of users here already. In particular, users that cannot handle losing, users who are too young for me to want to speak to, and, most importantly, people who harass me based on my play-style. Because my deck has a lot of depth, and requires a lot of thinking in order to use properly, I take a little longer to play. A number of users have been harassing me simply because of that, and I'd just like to shut down their whining. I'm just here to play the game, not listen to little kids whine.

Maybe with the option to play agaisnt players with +10/-10 lvls is enough. Anyway dont play decking out agaisnt new players. It is frustrating. If you play agaisnt them suggest surrendering or be nice and give them tips to improve their deck.

I remind again that if we are just 10 people beating the new players as mad for some easy points, this game is gonna suck. It is really better we all farmed and let newbies play between them.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

If the game cared about new players, base packs would not be 195, cards that literally every deck uses would not be so rare that they're reserved for the elite, and cheap secondary decks wouldn't stop working for days on end.

Stop worrying about being polite to new players, since the system is rigged in a way that it's impossible for them to catch up without point farming anyway. Soon the game is going to be nothing but old players and people who sit around grinding against people throwing games (psiqueatog is still on the rankings).
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Game doesnt have enough players to accommodate for score gap currently. Moreover, if I'd put a +-10 level matching system, how will it behave for future expansions and formats, where a Level 25 player can have the same inventory with a Level 1 player for a particular format?

Some players told me about high level players gaining same bits as low level players is not fair. So I have just thought about a new bit yielding schema where players below level 20 are awarded more bits and players above it less. Attached to this post you can find details about it. "bits modifier" column is the modifier that'll be applied to bits gained. For example when level is 13 (modifier=1.36) and you've got 60 score from a game, you'll gain 82 (60*1.36) bits. (Score is experience, bits are currency).

However this change should set more limits to market trading: players below level X shouldn't be allowed buy or sell in market, because players can open multiple accounts to buy out their stuff on main account. However, with this change, true new players cannot buy singles, is it an acceptable tradeoff? What should be X value? It should also be seperately discussed.

As we can see, changing something could bring up other problems or complexities. I know something isnt quite right about balance, but I expect well thought ideas (esp. with specific formulas).

@Verbatim
About poison disabling powers: This needs different rule schemas, and I'll be thinking about it.
Eevee's tail wag will be fixed with next version.
Curse & Strike Back and Haunter Transparency are the hardest problems currently. Thanks for playing it enough to find those out.

BTW, I'm working on something that'll allow everyone to code cards, following some guidelines. I dont know if anyone would be interested, though. It'll have syntax like the following:

Code:
basic hp:40, retreatCost:1, type:W, {
  weakness L
  move "Bubble" {
    energyCost W
    onAttack {
      damage 10
      flip {
        apply paralyzed
      }
    }
  }
  move "Withdraw" {
    energyCost W,C
    onAttack {
      flip {
        preventDamageNextTurn
      }
    }
  }
}

This was for Squirtle Base Set.
 

Attachments

  • yields.xls.zip
    4.3 KB · Views: 8
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

I think the main thing that needs to be done is something related to what Tash mentioned: Base packs need to be much lower than 195. If you really think they should be a bit more expensive, 125 should probably be the upper limit. I know there's a ton of good cards in there, but that's the issue: decks need those cards to run. As it is, the game is horribly biased toward those of us that got in before the change. On that note, the store is down to 36 Base Set packs so it may need to be restocked soon as it doesn't seem right to have those cards completely unavailable, especially with multiple sets left to come out before we get a real format without them.

There's also the issue of making certain "broken" cards far more rare. I understand what you were trying to do, but it ends up doing the opposite. Those who get lucky and pull those cards have a much easier time than those that haven't, and while I know the TCG was like that to an extent, this just makes it that much worse.

As for the bit difference, maybe it should depend on the level difference between players? By that I mean that the lower-level player will get a bit multiplier due to the lower odds of winning than normal, while the higher-level player gets it to act normally. That lets newer players have a chance to pick up some cards to make a decently competitive deck to hold up against those that have played longer, while not completely destroying the chance of those more experienced players to get extra cards. I'll have to do some thinking as to a formula for this but that might be a good way to handle it.

By the way, if you do get that syntax done I wouldn't mind helping code cards if I was able to figure it out well enough to do so. I'm sure you'd have explanations for it though.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

snowpointsecret said:
I think the main thing that needs to be done is something related to what Tash mentioned: Base packs need to be much lower than 195. If you really think they should be a bit more expensive, 125 should probably be the upper limit. I know there's a ton of good cards in there, but that's the issue: decks need those cards to run. As it is, the game is horribly biased toward those of us that got in before the change. On that note, the store is down to 36 Base Set packs so it may need to be restocked soon as it doesn't seem right to have those cards completely unavailable, especially with multiple sets left to come out before we get a real format without them.

There's also the issue of making certain "broken" cards far more rare. I understand what you were trying to do, but it ends up doing the opposite. Those who get lucky and pull those cards have a much easier time than those that haven't, and while I know the TCG was like that to an extent, this just makes it that much worse.
This is what I was trying to say for some time. If you can't pull Blastoise? Run something else. If you can't pull Hitmonchan? Run something else. If you can't pull computer search/itemfinder/pluspower/ER/gust? Too bad, almost any deck you try to build is gimped. (although SER can die in a fire for all I care)

Heck, I'm running Haymaker and I can still feel the significant difference in consistency against players with 2-3 computer searches/itemfinders. I don't know how people who can't get any are supposed to keep up.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

I just pulled my fourth Blastoise on a string, so I have the potential to become one of these "elite" players that are virtually unstoppable because of their luck, and giving new players a very slim chance of ever keeping up, because they only get 10 bits per game. And after the twentieth game they lose, they can finally buy a pack where they are presented with such lovely cards as Pidgeotto, Clefairy Doll, and Magneton.

I was gonna suggest that the current "super rare" cards should be given as rewards/prizes for completing quests or winning tournaments, akin to the promotional cards we discussed earlier.

But forget that. Just like the upcoming booster packs that will contain nothing but Energy cards, make it so the store provides packs that contain nothing but Trainer cards. Since there are less of them, they'll be a lot cheaper (about half), and they should contain no more than five Trainer cards a pop.

2 Common/Uncommon.
1 Rare.

Or if you prefer, six cards, where:

3 Common.
2 Uncommon.
1 Rare.

But this might create some onscreen asymmetry, and that's never cool to look at.

As for the Pokémon, I have no good solution. What you could do, in tandem with what I said above, reduce the chance of drawing any Trainer cards in the already existing Pokémon booster packs to 0, maximizing your chances of getting a strong Pokémon card rare (because nothing is more irritating than pulling something stupid like Clefairy Doll for your rare card in a pack that costs four standard wins).

I'm honestly patting myself on the back over how good the idea I just came up with is. I don't see any real flaws with it.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

BTW, the situation doesn't happen often, but how does the simulator handle powers that trigger at the same time? (for instance, when Erika's Dratini is sniped with a Brock's Rhydon in play) According to the rules, the defending player gets to decide what order these things happen in, due to the outcome differing based on which is used first.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Well, this matter is complex. We need a system that can run with lots or little players, that helps begginers but prevents veterans from creating new accounts, and can´t be based on level as you can start a new format with high level.

Here is my proposal:
- Giving values to the cards from 1 to 10 according to their quality (I can do that). As an example: energies, worst basic pokemon and trainers(1), switch, potion, better basic pokemon (2), gust of wind, pluspower, good charmander, voltorb, bill (3)... electabuzz hitmochan magmar oak (7), removals blastoise computer search (10).
- A system that calculates automatically the Summation (Σ) value of every deck you build (starting decks would be 120-180, middle 240-300, best haymakers 420-480). It can also be the average(1-10), the one we think is easier to understand.
- Giving bits and experience according to the value of your deck and the value of your opponent’s deck.

Advantages:
-It makes begginers get more bits.
-It doesn’t ban the best cards but it promotes you make decks with little of those, which is good cause we can play more decks and begginers also have more chances to win.
-We can make tournaments in which you can use all the cards but we can also make tournaments with a limit value (i.e.: 5 max aveg.) that promotes deckbuilding and making the most of worse pokemon and trainers.

Disadvantages:
- Getting balance about values and rewards formula could not be got at first time we try it.

Formulas:
I have been thinking much about this cause It would be fair that a low deck beating a good deck gets an awesome reward as it is quite unlikely. However, that is the perfect situation for anyone farming... So there are 2 solution:

- First options: not giving that awesome reward. The reward given is the same but the distribution changes according to the difference in value of the decks.

Formula:

deckdifference=(deckvaluewinner-deckvalueloser)/240
If deckdifference>1 so
deckdifference = 1

If deckdifference<-1 so
deckdifference = -1
"This is a value -1 to +1 according to the difference”

winner reward= (present winner reward) - (present loser reward) *(deckdifference)
loser reward= (present loser reward) + (present loser reward)*(deckdifference)

"I explain so everyone can understand it. If both decks have the same value, deckdifference is 0 and we get the same rewards we are getting now. If there is a difference, from 0 to 4 average points (0 to 240 summatory points), the rewards are modified according to that difference.
Let’s see some cases. If player1 has an extremely better deck (+4 avg. points) than player 2:
Reward now Reward with my formula
Player 1(60) Player 2(10) Player 1(50) Player 2(20)
Player 1(60) Player 2(35) Player 1(25) Player 2(70)
Player 1(40) Player 2(20) Player 1(20) Player 2(40)
Player 1(15) Player 2(10) Player 1(5) Player 2(20)*
Player 1(10) Player 2(10) Player 1(0) Player 2(20)*
Player 1(10) Player 2(60) Player 1(0) Player 2(70)
Player 1(35) Player 2(60) Player 1(0) Player 2(95)
Player 1(20) Player 2(40) Player 1(0) Player 2(60)
Player 1(10) Player 2(15) Player 1(0) Player 2(25)
Player 1(10) Player 2(10) Player 1(0) Player 2(20)

If player1 has better deck (+2 avg. points) than player 2:
Reward now Reward with my formula
Player 1(60) Player 2(10) Player 1(55) Player 2(15)
Player 1(60) Player 2(35) Player 1(42.5) Player 2(47.5)
Player 1(40) Player 2(20) Player 1(30) Player 2(30)
Player 1(15) Player 2(10) Player 1(10) Player 2(15)*
Player 1(10) Player 2(10) Player 1(0) Player 2(20)*
Player 1(10) Player 2(60) Player 1(5) Player 2(65)
Player 1(35) Player 2(60) Player 1(42.5) Player 2(77.5)
Player 1(20) Player 2(40) Player 1(10) Player 2(50)
Player 1(10) Player 2(15) Player 1(5) Player 2(20)

*As you might see if player2 just start a match and surrenders or he loses fast he gets 20 free points , instead of previous 10-10, which is not fair.
The only solution I have found for this is changing your reward system. Instead of giving 10 base points to both, you should give 10 points just to the winner. And instead of giving 20 points to winner after x time/turn (I am not sure what you programmed), you could give 2 points to winner and 1 point to loser every 2turns or xtime until 20. This way all would work fine.

-Second options: the very good deck losing bits so the bits given by the system is not bigger than normal.
I would develop formulas just if you agreed that losing bits against bad decks and getting huge rewards beating more expensive decks would be cool.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

I wanna conduct a little experiment. I created a format/metagame with one rule: You are only allowed one Basic Pokémon in your deck. Basically, a 1v1 format. One Basic Pokémon, with 59 other cards to support you. I have a deck made already. I want to see where we can take this.
 
TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Verbatim said:
I wanna conduct a little experiment. I created a format/metagame with one rule: You are only allowed one Basic Pokémon in your deck. Basically, a 1v1 format. One Basic Pokémon, with 59 other cards to support you. I have a deck made already. I want to see where we can take this.
So basically it comes down to who goes first? Have you actually played any games in this format? It seems interesting but just won't work in my opinion. Interestingly enough the ability to donk just gets better and better once future sets are released. However a slight variation where both players only have one prize to take might work (this is commonly referred to as sudden death)? Honestly I think all current sets should be incorporated before alternate formats are added.
 
RE: TCG ONE - full featured online pokemon tcg simulator [CAREER MODE Live]

Tash said:

I battled Psiqueatog, he's really nice but he has alot of cards.


Verbatim said:
I wanna conduct a little experiment. I created a format/metagame with one rule: You are only allowed one Basic Pokémon in your deck. Basically, a 1v1 format. One Basic Pokémon, with 59 other cards to support you. I have a deck made already. I want to see where we can take this.

You mean your Chansey deck?
 
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