OU: Strategy The X and Y Metagame Discussion Thread

RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Back to Sticky Web for a sec, turns out Masquerain gets it. While it's not statistically as good as Galvantula (mainly the 48 point difference in speed), it does boast a few notable niches that could lead to it getting a teamslot instead.

- Access to Defog. It can spin away the Sticky Web that your opponent lays down and then set up Sticky Web again.
- Immunity to Sticky Web
- Sleep Powder
- Statistically bulkier than Galvantula even before Intimidate (70/62/82 vs 70/60/60).
- The threat of Scald burns can stop some physical attackers from risking the switchin
- Kind of a stretch, but Quiver Dance + Baton Pass could be kinda interesting.

Don't see it getting used as much as Galvantula, but I do see it or Smeargle taking the reigns in the tiers where Galvantula is banned.

The more exciting thing in my opinion is that this opens up a whole new breeding pool for Sticky Web (the Water 1 Egg group).
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

The thing is though, its taking 50% hp damage just by switching in. It just doesn't have the utility to make its nice movepool worth it.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Another huge thing is that Galvantula has somewhat of an offensive presence, which is huge for anything looking to set hazards. Masquerain doesn't really force anything out to get free opportunities.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

The Defog users I'm most excited for are Empoleon and Flygon. Empoleon resist SR, has awesome typing, and is able to reapply its own SR. It is also threatening enough where it has to be dealt with. Flygon also resist SR and is immune to all other hazards. Awesome!
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Perhaps it's time to advance from weather... The Sticky Web strategies I've seen so far aren't bad, but they do have big risks. Galvantula isn't a bad Pokemon, but it's not exactly bulky, and it's often a wasted spot going just for Sticky Web, as it can be OHKO'ed easily. It will take some guts to use such a strategy, I'm sure.
Oh, and don't expect weather to lose much. Weather strategies existed before the era of weather-inducing abilities or even Rocks. They will continue to exist after them.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Flygon is going to be interesting. As well as everything Pride mentioned, it also enjoys the nerf to HP Ice. It'll never regain the glory of premier revenge killer like in DPPt, but bulky Flygon might become a thing.
 
Pokemon VGC 2014- How will XY affect the VGC meta?

Hey guys,
Weather becomes extinct due to the new 5 turn rule, and Fairy-types are here to balance out Dragons.

My idea for a pairing-
Noivern @ Life Orb
Ability: Telepathy
Nature: Modest
IVs: 31/xx/xx/31/xx/31
-252 Sp.A
-252 Speed
-4 HP

-Boomburst
-Roost
-Dragon Pulse
-U-Turn

Boomburst can ABSOLutely not be turned down. 140 bp, all hit, 100% accuracy, no drawbacks. It's partner is also immune, meaning it only hurts the opposing Pokemon.

Roost is for healing after LO/Battle damage, where it's partner can cover for it.

Dragon Pulse is STAB special move, for when Boomburst just won't do the job.

U-Turn is for making a quick getaway when Noivern is in a sticky situation.

Aaaannnd It's partner.... He's new, He's Ghost, He's a Sword, It's AEGISLASH!

Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
Nature: Naughty
IVs- 30/31/31/xx/xx/31
-252 atk
-20 HP
-116 def
-116 speed

-King's Shield
-Swords Dance
-Iron Head
-Sacred Sword/Shadow Claw

King's Shield is Aegislashes Primary Defensive option, when Noivern is doing it's job or when i'm getting swept.

Swords Dance is used in Shield Mode, so he can bulk himself while defending.

Iron head is a STAB attack, with an extra bonus of flinching. It is also Super Effective on fairies, Noivern's biggest weakness.

Sacred Sword is a Fighting attack, which bypasses stat changes on the opponent, but it isn't STAB. Shadow claw is a STAB move with high critical chance, so a good alternative.

What are the issues here?
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

bacon said:
I like how XY turned the most useless HM in history into the best move in the game.
Click to expand...
Well, removing Reflect/Light Screen/Safeguard from your opponent's side in Gen 5 didn't make it entirely useless then (Ghosts are also immune to Brick Break, but not Defog), but yeah.
Fun stuff.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Defog Flygon sounds really interesting for the reasons Pride said. It was really outclassed in the offensive role in Gen5, but I don't see how it could fill the support role with just Defog (no Stealth Rock ;_; ). Defog + 3 Attacks maybe? But that sounds rather weak.

I think Empoleon fits the bill as more of a Defog supporter. Defog / Stealth Rock / Roar / Scald in a specially defensive set. 10 resistances is pretty sweet and 60 base speed means it doesn't really care about Sticky Web.

Also I don't think weather is dead, but I do think it's harder to use now.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

You're underestimating Flygon's utility, it does have access to U-Turn, Dragon Tail, Roost, and Toxic.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Maybe a set consisting of Earthquake/Toxic/Defog/Roost? It's not being threatened by Forretress and Skarmory anymore to warrant using Fire Blast, and it can't really take adavantage of its Dragon STAB as easily this gen.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Flygon might be "Weak" (100/80 attacking stats) but the power that its moves possess would make up for it, I think. As an offensive pokemon, it has access to a STAB combination that only the new gorund/dragon thing shares (Earthquake/Outrage hits hard, even off of base 100 Attack), as well as U-turn to keep momentum. You've got Draco Meteor too for some decent surprise value, and Fire Blast for coverage.

While its defenses also may be lackluster (80/80/80), Flygon's got access to great support moves that Pride listed as well, and although it doesn't have a ton of resistances, the ones it has are very important. It's Immune to Ground and Electric, and it resists Fire, Rock, and Poison, which should actually be a thing now thanks to fairies. Finding a good pokemon that resists EdgeQuake alone is difficult, one with instant recovery is even better. Not to mention it resists SR, and is immune to Tspikes and Spikes (and Sticky Web? Are things with Levitate immune to that?) Base 100 Speed for Defog is nice too. Flygon is one of, if not the fastest Defog user that isn't weak to SR.

Now I'm not saying Flygon is the Jesus of all pokemon now, but its unique typing and versatile movepool give it plenty of options to work with.

I like Empoleon a lot this next gen. Its typing gives it no less than NINE resistances (eleven until they shafted the Steel-type -.-) and an immunity. Defensively using Defog is great, although it's going to have severe 5 moveslot syndrome choosing between Scald, Ice Beam, Roar, Protect, Toxic, SR, and Defog. Great versatility though. I can't imagine switching in a pokemon predicting a defog only to get set up on with Agility, and then pummeled by Life Orb Hydro Pump.

I am pretty sure I already know the answer to this, but I'll ask anyways. Magic Bounce does nothing to affect defog, correct? It's not a damaging move like Rapid Spin is, so I'd figure I'd ask. My logic would be "no" since Defog affects both sides of the field.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

I wouldn't think so, since Magic Bounce reflects moves that target the user or the user's side. Defog is a field effect, like Trick Room.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

How bout the defensive monster that is Carbink? I mean, sure everything else is 50, but 150 in both defense stats is ridiculous. Its typing is OK, not really super hindering or super helpful aside from the fact that it is immune to dragon and 4 times weak to steel. BUT THEN he gets moves like Stealth Rock, Safeguard, Dual Screens, Rest AND Sleeptalk, Confide AND Harden, Toxic, and Trick Room AND Gyro Ball. This dude is going places in my opinnion.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

RedPot said:
As an offensive pokemon, it has access to a STAB combination that only the new gorund/dragon thing shares (Earthquake/Outrage hits hard, even off of base 100 Attack), as well as U-turn to keep momentum.
Click to expand...

garchomp.jpg


Edit: Carbink is too big of set up fodder, it can't do anything productive other then lay down hazards. This cripples its viability in OU in my opinion.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Oh right. Mickey Mouse dragon is a thing I guess.

As for weather, I'm liking the nerfs a lot. Not because weather will be bad, because honestly it will still be good. But I like that it's harder to play, and it's going to make people think more on both sides of the field. It's bringing a lot of skill back into the game, I think. I also wonder what will happen with Sand Veil and Snow Cloak since their respective weathers are only temporary, but I wouldn't think anything would change with them.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Ohman177 said:
How bout the defensive monster that is Carbink? I mean, sure everything else is 50, but 150 in both defense stats is ridiculous. Its typing is OK, not really super hindering or super helpful aside from the fact that it is immune to dragon and 4 times weak to steel. BUT THEN he gets moves like Stealth Rock, Safeguard, Dual Screens, Rest AND Sleeptalk, Confide AND Harden, Toxic, and Trick Room AND Gyro Ball. This dude is going places in my opinnion.
Click to expand...
You just described Registeel, just with a different typing.
As long as Registeel exists, it outclasses Carbink, because, based on what you said, it gets most of the same stuff. The difference is that Registeel has 75 in both offenses, and 80 in HP.

I mean, it might hold off until Registeel is legal I guess, but Carbink doesn't sound all that astounding, honestly.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Anything to make Meowstic work? It has subpar stats but prankster is a fun thing to use along with access to screens. It might make a better performer in VGC than in "Smogon Format" however.
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

Meowstic will work in VGC, probably replacing Sableye. Since it can't learn Tailwind, I doubt it can replace stuff like Eviolite Murkrow or Whimsicott, but it still has access to Dual Screens, T-Wave(?), and I THINK Hypnosis... Combined with its rather good speed it can make a decent support I guess...
 
RE: The X and Y Metagame Speculation Thread

I can confirm meowstic gets Twave, though I can't quite see it replacing Sableye (seeing as it doesn't get Will o Wisp or recover, thus can't use burn as pseudo defense support + residual damage or as burn-stall). Unless it's an egg move no one has discovered yet, it also doesn't get taunt, which is a huge selling point on Sableye too.
 
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