Not to forget, your identity could have been kept a secret this way.
Finished Werewolf XXXIII: Order in the Court!- Congratulations Law!
- Thread starter quakingpunch73
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I don't think you get what a safeclaim is. An ideal safeclaim will have virtually no links to the flavour of a scum role. Unless there was some way to confirm his role, he still can be scum as much as town. Did PMJ claim getting nightkilled and dogger claim dying from poison in the dead chat (which I think you're using, right)?
So, who do you suggest we should have lynched yesterday, if Luis kept quiet about Camo?
I just need to find the time. I'm a bit congested with schoolwork atm. :/
I just want to say it's been really interesting that scum has killed notable experienced players like PMJ and PP... I would like to say maybe scum has more newer players, but Camo flipped scum so that theory is possibly out the window. I am even more suspicious of Robin now that they said Luis should've used his vig kill on Camo and possibly have us waste a lynch during the day.
Oh, derp, those two facts definitely didn't connect in my brain. xD
Yeah... PMJ's basically town then. xD
@thegrovylekid Why does PMJ not want town to know his role? Has he told you?
@Robin Aisaga I targeted Mia because she was already suspicious, and for a lot of us. You wanted me to use my ability on another random player that, while could be scum, we had no hints of that? Tell me: which player would /you/ have targeted last night if you had my ability.
That's a lot of dead people.
Since Camo flipped scum, I tried to check back on his posts from Day 2 wondering if maybe there are clues, and bbninjas has suggested as much at the tail end of yesterday. My note-taking is a little messy and long; if you want to take a look at it, I've put it under the spoiler tag.
To summarize it for those who don't feel like reading all that:
1) Camo went after really hard on Celever yesterday. This becomes more obvious looking at it on a per-post basis.
2) He voted for a couple of people (Skyleaf, KX) with somewhat valid reasoning and even posted a long case on someone (Luis) but he quickly dropped them.
3) He disappeared after Luis revealed his seer result.
I already posted about this late yesterday, but Camo really did increase his pressure and focus on Celever after simsands posted his case and several people got on it. Some minor cases popped up afterwards (like Miyami (the stolen item) and Robin (PMJ didn't want the RNG-lynching badge and went after the source)) but Camo rarely, if ever, commented on them. You guys already said it wasn't much to mind, but I think it's weird how quickly Camo lowered his priority on the Luis case, with the reasoning that he's more convinced on a case someone else made than the one he himself made? I'm not sure if that's normal or not, but I think the underlying motive was that he really wanted to lynch Celever. I know that Camo is known for going after Celever, but in this game at least, I think there's a different/additional reason why Camo wanted to lynch Celever and urgently so. The reason and implications for that, I have no idea.
While yesterday I posted a conspiracy theory on Camo and simsands being a scum duo, analyzing the order of posts more closely I could see the possibility that town simsands genuinely posted his case on Celever and Camo just used it as a springboard to launch his focused pressure on Celever. Though, my view on the original case being a little exaggerated hasn't changed.
However, there's still yet the possibility that it could be staged/deliberate on Camo's part. I'll observe Celever today.
@Robin Aisaga Did you get your evidence back from Miyami?
@Luispipe8 I think your claim checks out. What exactly about Miyami did you suspect? Was it the thievery? Or her posts?
Since Camo flipped scum, I tried to check back on his posts from Day 2 wondering if maybe there are clues, and bbninjas has suggested as much at the tail end of yesterday. My note-taking is a little messy and long; if you want to take a look at it, I've put it under the spoiler tag.
-votes for Celever (post 745)
-unvotes and votes for Skyleaf (for the retraction of her hasty question on who could be role cops)
-calls out for inactives
-suggests TGK to continue voting even if he finds Phoenix
-he thinks that it'd be better if TGK doesn't find Phoenix so that he accidentally doesn't drop hints
-votes KX for not paying attention/possible dumbtelling
-replies to bb about a PMJ quote not being scummy
-quotes and comments all Luis' past posts, concluding his posts don't have substance and he's hypocritical therefore he's scummy and voting him
-declares Celever is still an excellent lynch (after simsands posts his long case about Celever)
-says he's more confident about Celever's case than the Luis case he made, then votes Celever
-quotes Celever's latest posts and comments on them being scummy and convinces others to hop on the Celever lynch (continues for a couple pages)
-questions why people aren't voting Celever, says he scumslipped
-claims Celever OMGUS on that post where he says he gives up defending himself from simsands and Camo
-quotes Celever "Oh, but not responding to the arguments is an arbitrary "scumtell". Responding to the arguments is distracting, though -- this is a scumtell too." , says that this meant he has no defense and scumslipped
-Luis pops up and posts; Camo says he'll elaborate on the case he made on him, accuses him of being guilty of things he calls others out on
-some 20 posts later, Luis posts he seered Camo and he came up scum(Post 974)
-Camo doesn't post after this and day ends with his lynch
-unvotes and votes for Skyleaf (for the retraction of her hasty question on who could be role cops)
-calls out for inactives
-suggests TGK to continue voting even if he finds Phoenix
-he thinks that it'd be better if TGK doesn't find Phoenix so that he accidentally doesn't drop hints
-votes KX for not paying attention/possible dumbtelling
-replies to bb about a PMJ quote not being scummy
-quotes and comments all Luis' past posts, concluding his posts don't have substance and he's hypocritical therefore he's scummy and voting him
-declares Celever is still an excellent lynch (after simsands posts his long case about Celever)
-says he's more confident about Celever's case than the Luis case he made, then votes Celever
-quotes Celever's latest posts and comments on them being scummy and convinces others to hop on the Celever lynch (continues for a couple pages)
-questions why people aren't voting Celever, says he scumslipped
-claims Celever OMGUS on that post where he says he gives up defending himself from simsands and Camo
-quotes Celever "Oh, but not responding to the arguments is an arbitrary "scumtell". Responding to the arguments is distracting, though -- this is a scumtell too." , says that this meant he has no defense and scumslipped
-Luis pops up and posts; Camo says he'll elaborate on the case he made on him, accuses him of being guilty of things he calls others out on
-some 20 posts later, Luis posts he seered Camo and he came up scum(Post 974)
-Camo doesn't post after this and day ends with his lynch
To summarize it for those who don't feel like reading all that:
1) Camo went after really hard on Celever yesterday. This becomes more obvious looking at it on a per-post basis.
2) He voted for a couple of people (Skyleaf, KX) with somewhat valid reasoning and even posted a long case on someone (Luis) but he quickly dropped them.
3) He disappeared after Luis revealed his seer result.
I already posted about this late yesterday, but Camo really did increase his pressure and focus on Celever after simsands posted his case and several people got on it. Some minor cases popped up afterwards (like Miyami (the stolen item) and Robin (PMJ didn't want the RNG-lynching badge and went after the source)) but Camo rarely, if ever, commented on them. You guys already said it wasn't much to mind, but I think it's weird how quickly Camo lowered his priority on the Luis case, with the reasoning that he's more convinced on a case someone else made than the one he himself made? I'm not sure if that's normal or not, but I think the underlying motive was that he really wanted to lynch Celever. I know that Camo is known for going after Celever, but in this game at least, I think there's a different/additional reason why Camo wanted to lynch Celever and urgently so. The reason and implications for that, I have no idea.
While yesterday I posted a conspiracy theory on Camo and simsands being a scum duo, analyzing the order of posts more closely I could see the possibility that town simsands genuinely posted his case on Celever and Camo just used it as a springboard to launch his focused pressure on Celever. Though, my view on the original case being a little exaggerated hasn't changed.
However, there's still yet the possibility that it could be staged/deliberate on Camo's part. I'll observe Celever today.
@Robin Aisaga Did you get your evidence back from Miyami?
@Luispipe8 I think your claim checks out. What exactly about Miyami did you suspect? Was it the thievery? Or her posts?
he "doesn't want the scum knowing the satisfaction of the role they killed"
In my opinion the only thing we really wasted was yesterday's vote.
@Luis Your whole approach was wrong. The moment you knew that Camoclone was Daryan you should've kept it to yourself. Sure he would've been able to discuss and manipulate the choice of that day. But I think a different approach would've have been much more rewarding.
First of all you didn't have to confirm yourself town. You're basically giving the scum a secured night kill. Just read the newspapers.
You insta killed someone going to mostly your own accords. You should've taken the hero role and pierce Camo with certainty. The day vote can be (somewhat) trusted with the players.
If you really distrusted Miyami you should have used your camera on her! This way you could've gotten useful information about wolfs. Not that you should've suspected her of being scum. We already said that a stealing ability isn't necessarily a scum one. Definitly not if you consider the characters from the Ace Attorney universe that may have been a thief.
But It's a thing of the past and I'm not saying your approach is completely wrong. Let's get back to the investigation.
@Reinforce
Gumshoe had the badge on him when he died right? The only way I would be in possession of my badge is if I tampered with the crime scene or something
@Luis Your whole approach was wrong. The moment you knew that Camoclone was Daryan you should've kept it to yourself. Sure he would've been able to discuss and manipulate the choice of that day. But I think a different approach would've have been much more rewarding.
First of all you didn't have to confirm yourself town. You're basically giving the scum a secured night kill. Just read the newspapers.
You insta killed someone going to mostly your own accords. You should've taken the hero role and pierce Camo with certainty. The day vote can be (somewhat) trusted with the players.
If you really distrusted Miyami you should have used your camera on her! This way you could've gotten useful information about wolfs. Not that you should've suspected her of being scum. We already said that a stealing ability isn't necessarily a scum one. Definitly not if you consider the characters from the Ace Attorney universe that may have been a thief.
But It's a thing of the past and I'm not saying your approach is completely wrong. Let's get back to the investigation.
@Reinforce
Gumshoe had the badge on him when he died right? The only way I would be in possession of my badge is if I tampered with the crime scene or something
@Reinforce
Gumshoe had the badge on him when he died right? The only way I would be in possession of my badge is if I tampered with the crime scene or something
Yeah, I suppose you're right. I was just wondering if the item/evidence still managed to be passed even if the player has died (usually it depends on what order the hosts process the actions).
Robin, I was under suspicion myself. The only way I could both guarantee a scum lynch and still be alive was revealing Camo. And you're telling me I should have used another of my abilities on Camo so he'd die and leave the lynch at someone else where discussion wasn't really going anywhere? I'm not playing to be the hero. I'm playing to fulfill my wincon. And yes, what I found suspicious about Mia was the thievery and how she could return the evidence. With my kill I wasn't just trying to hit scum. Actually, I'm /sorta/ glad she was town. Because that's a lynch we're not wasting on a townie. We can discuss better Camo's behaviour and go from there.
And you still haven't answered my question. Who would have been your kill? And don't say Camo. I said last night.
And you still haven't answered my question. Who would have been your kill? And don't say Camo. I said last night.
You could've at least waited with the reveal until the day was half over. Every hour of the day is valuable discussion time. And to answer your question, I would not have used your ability last night, but if I really had to it would probably have been used on Celever. Because I think even though Camoclone tried to pressure it, Simsands made a pretty good case yesterday. There were a lot of contradictions in Celever's posts.
Was it? Oh well my bad
So I'm looking back at how Luis used his abilities, and I think they could've been used differently.
The artist ability was good on Camo. I think that was a nice play that also created a miracle for yourself, as the newspaper kinda says.
The camera ability should've been used on Miyami. Because she stole Robin's evidence, you'd have to think she would be able to do it again. Using it on her would reveal someone else's evidence, which would be helpful to the game.
And as for the Steel Samurai ability (which is great and I love it because the Steel Samurai is cool), that should've been used on Celever in my opinion. I'm reading him as scum right now and I'm getting a strange vibe from his posts, so seeing who he was would explain all his posts and all that.
The artist ability was good on Camo. I think that was a nice play that also created a miracle for yourself, as the newspaper kinda says.
The camera ability should've been used on Miyami. Because she stole Robin's evidence, you'd have to think she would be able to do it again. Using it on her would reveal someone else's evidence, which would be helpful to the game.
And as for the Steel Samurai ability (which is great and I love it because the Steel Samurai is cool), that should've been used on Celever in my opinion. I'm reading him as scum right now and I'm getting a strange vibe from his posts, so seeing who he was would explain all his posts and all that.
And how is the newspaper relevant? (Sorry if I sound rude.)
So we possibly lost a PR. Coolio. :v
Jesi, before she flipped, how was I supposed to know she could do it every night? She claimed it was a third player who sent the evidence to her. What was I going to learn? That the evidence went back to Robin? That's something not worth wasting a 1-shot ability on, since we'd know anyways. I ended up knowing nothing on Dogger, but at least I didn't get something we already knew.
Jesi, before she flipped, how was I supposed to know she could do it every night? She claimed it was a third player who sent the evidence to her. What was I going to learn? That the evidence went back to Robin? That's something not worth wasting a 1-shot ability on, since we'd know anyways. I ended up knowing nothing on Dogger, but at least I didn't get something we already knew.
Ok I didn't meant to post just that, meant to add stuff to it lol.
I thought that quote was funny. Anyway here are my thoughts on everyone so far, though I don't have a strong case for anything atm.
1. Celever definitely seems town to me
2. simsands leaning scum ##VOTE: simsands hasn't posted anything of substance today after being very active and going after celever
4. scattered mind nothing, no clue
5. Robin Aisaga leaning town, because of high prosector role and I read him as town
7. Reinforce neutral
8. bbninjas slight town
10. GM Draclord neutral, could be either
12. Luispipe8 basically confo town
14. Skyleaf2000 see scattered mind
16. PikaMasterJesi just guessing slight scum
17. Jabberwock strong town read
19. Cypher333 King Xerneas slight scum/new scum and inactive
20. Squirtle Squad neutral
I thought that quote was funny. Anyway here are my thoughts on everyone so far, though I don't have a strong case for anything atm.
1. Celever definitely seems town to me
2. simsands leaning scum ##VOTE: simsands hasn't posted anything of substance today after being very active and going after celever
4. scattered mind nothing, no clue
5. Robin Aisaga leaning town, because of high prosector role and I read him as town
7. Reinforce neutral
8. bbninjas slight town
10. GM Draclord neutral, could be either
12. Luispipe8 basically confo town
14. Skyleaf2000 see scattered mind
16. PikaMasterJesi just guessing slight scum
17. Jabberwock strong town read
19. Cypher333 King Xerneas slight scum/new scum and inactive
20. Squirtle Squad neutral
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