What about the Death Penalty?

[Polaris]

Jails may fill up with criminals, but killing them off isn't the right way to go about solving that. After all, they are still human beings and still have human dignity. There are very few things they can do, if any, that can take that away, and regardless, we should still try to rehabilitate over kill them. Maybe just my opinion, but I think it makes sense. We need to find the real source of the lack of morality and strike there, not just kill those who disobey. Then the government gets in danger of ruling simply by sword, as they would only keep people in check by threatening them with pain and death, and that could lead to all kinds of nasty things.

When you kill someone or harm them... Something changes in a person. They are no longer the same. It is unnatural for a human to kill another human. Those who have killed before for enjoyment have the capability of doing it again and will suffer from some kind of depression or mental health issue.

It is next to impossible to rehabilitate those who have voluntarily killed another for pure enjoyment/satisfaction.

Also, pain is temporary. Threats of pain are nothing. Pain really does make you stronger. IMO again, I think our country would be better off with leading by intimidation and a strong hand.

If it's so unnatural for a human to kill another human, than explain all the killing and death related video games. Explain the Roman empire's colleseum games. Explain just why death and the killing of others is so glorified in every culture of humanity.
The killing of others is something all humans are somehow drawn to, but realize its horror and absurdity either in time or the instant they preform it, or simply when they truly think about it (unless they're insane, or have had their consciences completely warped by being taught certain things over a long period of time (ex. terrorists)).

If having a government rule by fear and threatening its citizens is so great, explain why North Korea, the USSR, ect. weren't great countries that all of its citizens adored and why the world didn't and don't glorify them for the way they operate.

I never mentioned inflicting pain on people, I said REHABILITATE them. If we can't respect our fellow humans, why should they respect us? That's my logic, there's always cultural reasons for why some people choose to be "evil" and harm others, and elimintating them, or at least trying, is the best we can do (ex. racism in America. Through figures such as MLKjr., certain traditional ways of thinking and acting had been changed). If we don't teach that human life is special and something to be protected, a country is absolutely trash and is setting itself up for making it a kind of hell in a bucket.

 

[r3skyline]

When you kill someone or harm them... Something changes in a person. They are no longer the same. It is unnatural for a human to kill another human. Those who have killed before for enjoyment have the capability of doing it again and will suffer from some kind of depression or mental health issue.

It is next to impossible to rehabilitate those who have voluntarily killed another for pure enjoyment/satisfaction.

Also, pain is temporary. Threats of pain are nothing. Pain really does make you stronger. IMO again, I think our country would be better off with leading by intimidation and a strong hand.

If it's so unnatural for a human to kill another human, than explain all the killing and death related video games. Explain the Roman empire's colleseum games. Explain just why death and the killing of others is so glorified in every culture of humanity.
The killing of others is something all humans are somehow drawn to, but realize its horror and absurdity either in time or the instant they preform it, or simply when they truly think about it (unless they're insane, or have had their consciences completely warped by being taught certain things over a long period of time (ex. terrorists)).

If having a government rule by fear and threatening its citizens is so great, explain why North Korea, the USSR, ect. weren't great countries that all of its citizens adored and why the world didn't and don't glorify them for the way they operate.

I never mentioned inflicting pain on people, I said REHABILITATE them. If we can't respect our fellow humans, why should they respect us? That's my logic, there's always cultural reasons for why some people choose to be "evil" and harm others, and elimintating them, or at least trying, is the best we can do (ex. racism in America. Through figures such as MLKjr., certain traditional ways of thinking and acting had been changed). If we don't teach that human life is special and something to be protected, a country is absolutely trash and is setting itself up for making it a kind of hell in a bucket.

Before i go on with anything else.

Have you EVER had to point a weapon at another person and go through the motions?

 

[Polaris]

If it's so unnatural for a human to kill another human, than explain all the killing and death related video games. Explain the Roman empire's colleseum games. Explain just why death and the killing of others is so glorified in every culture of humanity.
The killing of others is something all humans are somehow drawn to, but realize its horror and absurdity either in time or the instant they preform it, or simply when they truly think about it (unless they're insane, or have had their consciences completely warped by being taught certain things over a long period of time (ex. terrorists)).

If having a government rule by fear and threatening its citizens is so great, explain why North Korea, the USSR, ect. weren't great countries that all of its citizens adored and why the world didn't and don't glorify them for the way they operate.

I never mentioned inflicting pain on people, I said REHABILITATE them. If we can't respect our fellow humans, why should they respect us? That's my logic, there's always cultural reasons for why some people choose to be "evil" and harm others, and elimintating them, or at least trying, is the best we can do (ex. racism in America. Through figures such as MLKjr., certain traditional ways of thinking and acting had been changed). If we don't teach that human life is special and something to be protected, a country is absolutely trash and is setting itself up for making it a kind of hell in a bucket.

Before i go on with anything else.

Have you EVER had to point a weapon at another person and go through the motions?

What are you implying? I've stated this:

The killing of others is something all humans are somehow drawn to, but realize its horror and absurdity either in time or the instant they preform it, or simply when they truly think about it (unless they're insane, or have had their consciences completely warped by being taught certain things over a long period of time (ex. terrorists)).

That should give you all you need to know for that question.

 

[Chaos Jackal]

Have you EVER had to point a weapon at another person and go through the motions?

Have you? If you have, then please explain the feeling.

 

[Haunted Water]

If it's so unnatural for a human to kill another human, than explain all the killing and death related video games. Explain the Roman empire's colleseum games. Explain just why death and the killing of others is so glorified in every culture of humanity.
The killing of others is something all humans are somehow drawn to, but realize its horror and absurdity either in time or the instant they preform it, or simply when they truly think about it (unless they're insane, or have had their consciences completely warped by being taught certain things over a long period of time (ex. terrorists)).

If having a government rule by fear and threatening its citizens is so great, explain why North Korea, the USSR, ect. weren't great countries that all of its citizens adored and why the world didn't and don't glorify them for the way they operate.

I never mentioned inflicting pain on people, I said REHABILITATE them. If we can't respect our fellow humans, why should they respect us? That's my logic, there's always cultural reasons for why some people choose to be "evil" and harm others, and elimintating them, or at least trying, is the best we can do (ex. racism in America. Through figures such as MLKjr., certain traditional ways of thinking and acting had been changed). If we don't teach that human life is special and something to be protected, a country is absolutely trash and is setting itself up for making it a kind of hell in a bucket.

Before i go on with anything else.

Have you EVER had to point a weapon at another person and go through the motions?

It all depends on your standing with that person, r3. I've once put my semi-auto .22 LR up to someone's head for breaking into my house. I had no quarrels about letting one modified bullet off the chain should he try to strike. I asked him nicely to leave and when he said no, it turned into a "Your funeral" kind of moment.

Although I may have not cared for his life because I tend to be very cold-hearted from time to time.
Edit: Also, no, I didn't kill the guy. But if he were to try and disarm me, it wouldn't go so well for him. If he were to succeed, I would've fired the round off during the struggle, and then run to my bedroom. What I would've came back with should've scared him off - dual-wielding baseball bats.

 

[r3skyline]

Have you EVER had to point a weapon at another person and go through the motions?

Have you? If you have, then please explain the feeling.

Because my avatar is that for no reason in particular lol.

Ill tell you this, I for sure as hell did not want to die, and I would be damned if I would let someone take my life from me. I earned what I have today through hard work and to have it stripped away like that I will not let happen.

A lot went through my head. Mainly fear, nobody wants to die and I used that fear to get myself to realize that it was a real situation and I needed to come out the victor.

Polaris there is a difference between video games and real life. It is glamorized but when it comes down to being face to face with it, it is a completely different story.

Ruling by fear and threats would work. I mean come on. Look at how the majority of us whom were raised old school turned out to be. My parents are old school Hispanics. Weren't afraid to raise the belt to me. How did I turn out? I have never been arrested, never smoked, and never done anything illegal or dumb that would get me in trouble. Now I am in the army with a top secret clearance and I can tell you 100% I owe it all to how my parents raised me. With fear and threats.

Fear drives people to do well. Afraid of failing that test? Study more. Afraid of not getting that job? Work harder. Come on, fear is standard in everyday life.

HW - if you're pointing a weapon/pistol at someone, chances are the situation is pretty bad.

 

[TheTPCProductionz]

See I have been raised in the modern day, I am 17. My parents are divorced , my dad lives 3 hours away. I owe the way I have worked out to both of them, my dad is a Chief in the Navy and my mum has worked with kids her whole life. Most of my family are military, well the men anyway. I have been brought up to respect others, be polite and voice my opinions. I have never smoked, I hardly ever drink, I have never been in trouble with the police nor have I ever done drugs. Up bringing is a massive factor, in how people turn out. Though environmental ,culture and technological advances have an impact aswell. Fear is whats keeps us in line, without fear then it's chaos. People commit crimes, because they have no fear.

 

[Chaos Jackal]

I couldn't disagree more. Fear creates a fake sense of respect and those ruled by fear often are ready to break free of it at any cost. My parents never raised me with fear and threats, but with respect towards my person. Fear has no place in my life. Yet I do not smoke, drink, get in fights or anything. On the contrary, I have a strong sense of justice. And whenever I see the rule of fear, I fight it openly.
Then again, it's only my opinion. Plus, my society is kinda different than yours, and this might have played its role.

 

[Elite Stride]

Completely agreeing with ChillBill here. Although I know how fear can be effective, I certainly do not think it's by any means necessary for maintaining society, nor is an environment shrouded in fears a healthy one. The same exact results can come out of an environment similar to what ChillBill described, I can relate to that personally. Plus, I don't think it has to do with a difference in culture either because I live across the world from him.

Now, we can look at the term 'fear' in reverential terms too, and in that sense we might all have the same view here. But you guys seem to be referring to the more common meaning of literal fright.

Just as a note, from here on out we need to be tying this back to the death penalty, otherwise we are diverging. If any of you feel like creating a separate topic for this discussion would benefit, please feel free.

 

[Polaris]

Have you? If you have, then please explain the feeling.

Polaris there is a difference between video games and real life. It is glamorized but when it comes down to being face to face with it, it is a completely different story.

Re-read what I've said, because you just repeated what I originally stated. My point was that the desire to kill is innate, but the reality of understanding how terrible it is also innate. But some people don't understand how it is terrible, despite it's innate-ness, for reasons I listed. That doesn't make them no longer human.

Ruling by fear and threats would work. I mean come on. Look at how the majority of us whom were raised old school turned out to be. My parents are old school Hispanics. Weren't afraid to raise the belt to me. How did I turn out? I have never been arrested, never smoked, and never done anything illegal or dumb that would get me in trouble. Now I am in the army with a top secret clearance and I can tell you 100% I owe it all to how my parents raised me. With fear and threats.

Fear drives people to do well. Afraid of failing that test? Study more. Afraid of not getting that job? Work harder. Come on, fear is standard in everyday life.

Fear works, true, but why do we need to threaten to murder people if they do something wrong? Isn't fear of being isolated in a cell enough? And are you denying that we shouldn't try to teach others why we shouldn't do wrong in the first place?