XY-On

[Mr.Muffin]

Do people think Ace-Specs will be brought back? I saw them as a good mechanic, and I'm fairly surprised they took them away, to be honest. Max Potion will probably end up being reprinted, I'd think.

TCPi isn't know for bringing concepts or mechanics back from the grave. Star, Lost World, Lvl X, and Prime are all dead and will stay that way.

 

[NintendoAlian]

Here is my list:

Tier 1
Yveltal EX Varients:Yveltal/M Manectric, Yveltal/Toad, Yveltal/Hammers, Yveltal/Hydreigon
Reason: Tier one right now. Evil Ball will do a lot of damage and will still be great

Pyroar/Seismitoad
Reason: Seismitoad shuts down Item cards, and since Donphan will rotate, Pyroar will see a lot more play.

Swampert/Slurpuff
Reason: With Dive Ball in format, and VirGen out, it can counter Pyroar and has the great search system

Tier 2:
Dragalge Poison
Reason: With VirGen out, it will poison unless your opponent is playing Sparkling Robe or Slurpuff XY.

Aromatisse
Reason: With Rainbow still in format, it will still see play. Possibly with Florges/Xerneas/M Gardevoir..

Gengar
Reason: Switch into Wobbuffet or Robo Substitute or even Aegislash

Lucario
Reason: It still has Strong Energy, Korrina, and Fighting Stadium, but without Landorus, it loses a lot of power.

Mega Manectric/Dragonite: M Manectric can accelerate energies onto a benched Pokemon, then Bust In with Dragonite, then use AZ or Super Scoop Up to pick up the Dragonite.

You may be asking "NintendoAlian, where's Bronzong?" Well, without Keldeo or Float Stone, you have to accelerate to the bench, then get to the active and attack.

 

[Mr.Muffin]

Here is my list:

Tier 1
Yveltal EX Varients:Yveltal/M Manectric, Yveltal/Toad, Yveltal/Hammers, Yveltal/Hydreigon
Reason: Tier one right now. Evil Ball will do a lot of damage and will still be great

Pyroar/Seismitoad
Reason: Seismitoad shuts down Item cards, and since Donphan will rotate, Pyroar will see a lot more play.

Swampert/Slurpuff
Reason: With Dive Ball in format, and VirGen out, it can counter Pyroar and has the great search system

Tier 2:
Dragalge Poison
Reason: With VirGen out, it will poison unless your opponent is playing Sparkling Robe or Slurpuff XY.

Aromatisse
Reason: With Rainbow still in format, it will still see play. Possibly with Florges/Xerneas/M Gardevoir..

Gengar
Reason: Switch into Wobbuffet or Robo Substitute or even Aegislash

Lucario
Reason: It still has Strong Energy, Korrina, and Fighting Stadium, but without Landorus, it loses a lot of power.

Mega Manectric/Dragonite: M Manectric can accelerate energies onto a benched Pokemon, then Bust In with Dragonite, then use AZ or Super Scoop Up to pick up the Dragonite.

You may be asking "NintendoAlian, where's Bronzong?" Well, without Keldeo or Float Stone, you have to accelerate to the bench, then get to the active and attack.

Swampert is a Stage 2 which is still too slow for the meta game.

 

[NintendoAlian]

Do people think Ace-Specs will be brought back? I saw them as a good mechanic, and I'm fairly surprised they took them away, to be honest. Max Potion will probably end up being reprinted, I'd think.

TCPi isn't know for bringing concepts or mechanics back from the grave. Star, Lost World, Lvl X, and Prime are all dead and will stay that way.

Well, they brought back EXs, so why not?

 

[Mr.Muffin]

TCPi isn't know for bringing concepts or mechanics back from the grave. Star, Lost World, Lvl X, and Prime are all dead and will stay that way.

Well, they brought back EXs, so why not?

ex and EX pokemon are different. EX pokemon are basic, and ex pokemon are their normal stages. The only similarity is the two prizes, and being of a higher rarity.

 

[pokedan24]

I think they'll make something similar to Ace-Specs. Maybe a series of trainers which all share the same name, but do different things. So you have to choose which four of them you want to play.

 

[Majestic_night]

Well I didn't think that they were going to rotate the whole black and white series I would have thought that LT was the only set to make it out as the last but if they are rotating plasma and I'm losing half of my cards anyway it makes sense to rotate all the remaining black and white sets

 

[Dark Espeon]

Hi folks,

Here are some thoughts based on cards that we already know and the proposed rotation to XY.on.

TIER 1

Yveltal Ex varients:
Yveltal Ex is still a force and does not need to focus on ohkos. It will be one of the fastest decks out. At the moment Mega Manectric Ex is an ideal addition to Yveltal but until the rotation occures we will have at least two more sets to obtain better options.

Mega Gardevoir Ex:
One of the few decks that can yield ohkos real fast with Xerneas non-Ex and Aromatisse. Replace the lost Max Potion and Ace card with Az and Escape Rope and the deck will be fine.

Mega Groundon Ex:
This will be one of the decks that can score ohkos with ease and Grass does not seem to be that dominant once Virizion is rotated out.

Mega Kyogre Ex:
Another fast deck that works similar to Yveltal decks in that is swarms with multiple attackers that can fuel each other fast.

TIER 2:

Gengar Ex variants:
The tactic is still nice but the loss of Sigiliph hurts since it was one of the best walls in this deck.

Seismitoad variants:
With Laser and Bank rotated out the deck looses a lot and will be unable to knock out the defender in two hits. You can still run it as an energy discard theme with several of the new cards but the reduced damage output will cost Seismitoad its spot on first tier.

Metal variants:
The deck will still be a little too slow for what it is able to do compared to the other viable deck options. You need to have two to three Bronzong and two attackers in addition to a means to switch between them. That costs a lot of resources in an environment that can score ohkos fast. The main issue is that their energy acceleration is a stage two and it only fuels the bench.

Night March variants:
With the new stadium that acts like Celebi Ex and Gourgeist this one can still be nice but it looses some speed at the same time.

You will notice that several decks are either centered around Mega evolutions or run them as assistance line. For that reason Pyroar will not be efficient in that format. I still believe that one of the reasons for this card was to lure the metagame into Mega evolutions but it took the release of better Mega evolutions and Spirit Links to achieve this aim since most decided to run stage one assistance lines instead. Now that Mega evolutions are better and sturdier Pyroar should have a hard time. The version from Phantom Gates can be decent in fire decks as a tech line to obtain board control and bypass Omega barrier.

 

[GadgetJax]

You may be asking "NintendoAlian, where's Bronzong?" Well, without Keldeo or Float Stone, you have to accelerate to the bench, then get to the active and attack.

Bronzong should still be strong without the help of those cards. Look at how strong Mewtwo/Eelektrik was, and it didn't even have access to Float Stone or Keldeo!

 

[NintendoAlian]

You may be asking "NintendoAlian, where's Bronzong?" Well, without Keldeo or Float Stone, you have to accelerate to the bench, then get to the active and attack.

Bronzong should still be strong without the help of those cards. Look at how strong Mewtwo/Eelektrik was, and it didn't even have access to Float Stone or Keldeo!

True, but that was a different format. Now, the format is about OHKO's.

 

[AnUpsetEmoZebra]

Does anyone think that Mienshao could replace Donphan? It's a possibility, since N and Mewtwo-EX won't be around anymore.

I don't think it's a great replacement. Shuffling itself back into the deck requires you to draw so much more to deal good damage each turn.

Atleast if we're talking about Mienshao from FuF it goes back into your hand not your deck.

 

[GadgetJax]

Bronzong should still be strong without the help of those cards. Look at how strong Mewtwo/Eelektrik was, and it didn't even have access to Float Stone or Keldeo!

True, but that was a different format. Now, the format is about OHKO's.

That might change by the time that rotation occurs. The only EX's that can really hit 200 or higher from XY-on are really Megas. Everything else usually hits for just about 150 max, and hitting higher numbers either requires a lot of energy (camperupt, yveltal, malamar) or support from other means. (fighting types)

 

[Dark Espeon]

Bronzong should still be strong without the help of those cards. Look at how strong Mewtwo/Eelektrik was, and it didn't even have access to Float Stone or Keldeo!

I listed Metal as tier two for the main reason that holds it down now. The acceleration comes from a stage one Pokémon and it accelerates one at a time to the bench. This means that the metal acceleration is slower than the other acceleration we have in the format. For instance: Grass and fairies accelerate from the deck on their first or second turn with a basic. Darkness and Fighting accelerate from the discard with a basic too and even Water and Fire also have more reliable acceleration that is faster and less restrictive. In addition metal attackers need three to four energies and cannot score ohkos without further cards devoted to them. Taken together metal requires more time and resources to yield results similar to other decks.

 

[pokedan24]

Bronzong should still be strong without the help of those cards. Look at how strong Mewtwo/Eelektrik was, and it didn't even have access to Float Stone or Keldeo!

I listed Metal as tier two for the main reason that holds it down now. The acceleration comes from a stage one Pokémon and it accelerates one at a time to the bench. This means that the metal acceleration is slower than the other acceleration we have in the format. For instance: Grass and fairies accelerate from the deck on their first or second turn with a basic. Darkness and Fighting accelerate from the discard with a basic too and even Water and Fire also have more reliable acceleration that is faster and less restrictive. In addition metal attackers need three to four energies and cannot score ohkos without further cards devoted to them. Taken together metal requires more time and resources to yield results similar to other decks.

That's why the deck struggles early game. Sometimes it's better to just attach manually with a stream of cheap, but efficient attackers.

 

[Toro Rosso]

True, but that was a different format. Now, the format is about OHKO's.

That might change by the time that rotation occurs. The only EX's that can really hit 200 or higher from XY-on are really Megas. Everything else usually hits for just about 150 max, and hitting higher numbers either requires a lot of energy (camperupt, yveltal, malamar) or support from other means. (fighting types)

I think you might need to revise your comment there. Most Megas can't realistically hit more than 200 reliably without additional support.

Mega-Charizard needs a whooping 5 energy to do so. Mega-Kangashkan needs Fliptini/Trick Coin to do so and it still involves a lot of luck. Mega-Manetric can't naturally. Mega-Lucario still needs Strong Energy to hit above 150. Mega-Heracross needs full HP to even OHKO.

So you can't really state that Megas can actually do so.

 

[Mora]

I don't think Pyroar anything deserves Tier 2; I'd have to say Tier 3 at the most. This new set seems to promote offensive evolutions, meaning Pyroar will gain at least a few bad match ups on top of the bad match ups it already has. It just don't think it will wall as much as it used to.

 

[cardgjammer]

I don't think Pyroar anything deserves Tier 2; I'd have to say Tier 3 at the most. This new set seems to promote offensive evolutions, meaning Pyroar will gain at least a few bad match ups on top of the bad match ups it already has. It just don't think it will wall as much as it used to.

Not to mention that Silent Lab can be considered a Garbotoxin replacement that can go around Intimidating Mane(only w/o the chance of abilities being regained if either one particular pokemon(Garbodor) is KO'd or at least has it's tool detached by any means(Starling Megaphone, Xerosic, among other tool-detaching means)), as the chances of finding a card that can remove the ability-lock originating from a stadium like that is less than an opponent-triggered tool discard, as you cannot search for stadiums w/o Ace Spec cards like Computer Search, or even Battle Compressor + Dowsing Machine, both combos that could have outdated parts after the next rotation, which I believe will leave us w/ Kalos Starter Set-On, due to the fact that LT isn't released in European languages other than US English. Wait a second... English? The same language the UK speaks? According to section 1.8 of the TCG Play! Pokemon rulebook, LT, although unofficially released in Europe by means of their local language being the same as the US, is still legal in European tournaments and leagues:

'1.8. Foreign Cards
The use of foreign-language cards have been known to create time delays and confusion at highlevel
Premier Events, where significant prizes are on the line. However, as the Pokémon TCG is
an international game, concessions must be made to help accommodate markets where
multiple languages are more common. Players are restricted on which language cards they can
use, based on the country where they are playing. The list of countries and regions below
defines which languages are considered local. Any other languages are considered foreign in
that country or region.

Canada
Local—English and French
Europe
Local—English, French, German, Italian, Spanish, and Portuguese
Mexico
Local—English and Spanish
South America
Local—English, Spanish, and Portuguese
United States, Asia Pacific, and South Africa
Local—English
Players are not permitted to use foreign cards at Premier Events.
For the Pokémon TCG World Championships and the Last Chance Qualifier, players are still only
permitted to use cards that are legal in their home markets. Reference cards are not required
for the Pokémon TCG World Championships or the Last Chance Qualifier.

^ However, since LT in Europe is an unofficial set to Europeans, since the origin source of those cards are from the US, and not the UK, if Plasma Blast is rotated out next rotation, it might make sense to take LT out, too, but not its pseudo-subset Kalos Starter Set(KSS), so it's not that radical of a rotation: just 4.5 sets, but I'm not going to jump it this time until it's official next year...Until then, judging from Primal Clash, I believe that Primal Groudon(aka the "New Fighting Metadeck")will dominate XY-On, whether this season or the next, whether or not Emerald Break will be tournament-legal at a time when some National tourneys are already over(US release week for TCG sets=53 days after JPN release, although JPN TCG releases are on Saturdays, while the US releases are on Wednesdays. If true, Emerald Break will be released in the US on May 6th(judging from M-Rayquaza tourney accommodation), meaning XY6 will be tourney-legal on May 27th, a time when some Nationals have already concluded), whether or not other cards are kicked out, and whether or not we get our replacements for significant amounts of critical pieces to our BLW-PLB staples... well, at this time, we don't have an N and/or Colress replacement yet...

 

[Ironman131]

Silent lab only shuts down basic pokemon abilities so itimidating mane would still work. Either they will keep Plamsa blast on or it will be the kalos starter set on. Lugia EX is in LTR and doing a LTR and on rotation would eliminate plasma energy making Lugia EX completly usles. I dont think Pokemon will leave a completly usless pokemon EX in the format because EX cards are probably their big money making cards right now.

 

[GadgetJax]

Here's a list of all the Tier 1 and 2 cards we would lose from an XY-on Format, each with a note on what they did.

-N
(Early game draw and late game disruption. Without it, the only AAA Shuffle supporter right now is Shauna)

-Plasma decks
(No duh)

-Empoleon
(Strong water attacker with good draw support. Essentialy being replaced by Ancient Swampert, to an extent.)

-Altaria
(Dragon enhancer. Won't be missed that much, though, since it's only Tier 1 combo was Garchomp, which is rotating as well)

-Celebi EX
(A better form of Shrine of Memories, since it can't be Stadium Countered. Without it, players will have to run several Shrine of Memories in order to run things like Gourgantic Gourgeist and Aggron-EX)

-Blastoise
(Fantastic energy acceleration. Without it, decks like Primal Kyogre-EX will be ever-so-slightly slower, and cards like M. Blastoise-EX will be nearly impossible to play in Tier 1)

-Keldeo EX
(Versatile Switch combo with Float Stone. Without it, Bronzong decks and decks that find trouble against Special Conditions will be harder to use.)

-Dusknoir
(Moves around damage counters. Without it, spread decks like Noivern and Gourgeist XY will have to rely on Meowstic.)

-Landorus EX
(Excessively strong Fighting Type. Without it, straight Fighting Decks only have Lucario-EX in terms of basic Fighting Types that can OHKO.)

-Flygon
(Spread tech. While not great, it was used quite a bit at the 2014 Worlds with Accelgor.)

-Skyla
(Best search Supporter. Without it, decks that require quick access to Trainers will have trouble.)

-Town Map
(Tracks down Prizes. Without it, decks might not be able to make use of 1-of lines of cards.)

-Computer Search
(Broken search card. Everything is slightly harmed from it going away.)

-Victini EX
(Good start-up energy acceleration. Nothing in particular that loses it, but it will be missed.)

-Trubbish
(Fun archetype that revolved around Masquerain and Sigilyph from Plasma Blast, though they all are rotating.)

-Donphan
(Incredible attacker with several comboes. Only major replacement for it is Mienshao, which falls prey to having to re-attach Energy and worry about hand disruption)

-Klinklang
(A cool archetype that paired with cards like Registeel-EX, Cobalion-EX, and Aegislash-EX. Isn't used much anymore, but used to be pretty great.)

-Cobalion EX
(Strong disruption and pierce attacker in Klinklang decks and Bronzong decks. Most of what it does best can be done by other cards nowadays, though.)

-Black Kyurem EX
(A very powerful archetype that comboed with Blastoise for OHKO's turnly.)

-Bicycle
(Quick hand draw item. Only incredible replacement for it is Roller Skates, which requires a coin flip.)

-Colress
(Great late-game draw card. Only suitable replacement right now is Shauna, as mentioned.)

-LaserBank
(Broken damage booster. Without it, Seismitoad-EX has no reliable way to stack quick damage without the use of Grenade Hammer.) why is that a bad thing?

-Dowsing Machine
(Trainer recovery. Is sort-of replaced with Trump Card, but still is really good right now.)

-Exeggcute
(Good Empoleon and Weavile combo. Nothing from XY is really missing it, though, not counting Ultra Ball)

-Flareon/Leafeon
(A strong archetype that focused all around Type advantage. It is really the only super competitive deck that I've ever been able to legitimately play, because of how inexpensive it is.)

-Electrode
(Okay draw support. Was used primarily in decks that need to draw outside of Supporters, because they used tech-supporters like Lysandre, Blacksmith, Flare Grunt, and Fan Club.)

-Mr Mime
(Incredible tech for decks that use bench support. Without it, Pokemon that have low HP will be harder to play against sniping decks.)

-Latias EX
(Attacker primarily used as a Pyroar counter in Plasma and Toolbox. Since Pyroar isn't used much anymore, and won't probably won't be at all once XY5 releases, I don't think this card is that important anyway for the 15-16 season)

-Float Stone
(Good with cards that have high retreat. The only suitable replacement for it, outside of directly switching, is Fairy Garden.)

-Superior Energy Retrieval
(A card used to recover energy in hand attachment acceleration decks. Without it, Sceptile will have to rely on the much weaker Energy Retrieval.)

-Virizion/Genesect EX
(Fantastic archetype. Was quick and powerful, with only a few bad match-ups.)

-Suicune/Sigilyph
(EX counter in many Toolbox and Hit, Run decks. Without it, the only card in the format that is immune to EX's is Pyroar, but only to Basic ones, not Megas.)

-Drifblim
(A strong Plasma and Psychic-weak counter.)

-Jirachi EX
(Absurdly useful Supporter searcher, though it is outclassed a bit by VS Seeker.)

-Haxorus
(Fun Plasma counter and Bronzong mix. Wasn't great, but could hit really high numbers for Stage 2 standards.)

-Iris
(Good damage booster, though it wasn't used often, outside of Lucario and Shaymin-EX.)

-Silver Bangle
(Better Muscle Band for non-EX's. Without it, many of the newer cards like Kingdra PRC and Blaziken FUF are shy of Knock-Outs against 180HP EX's.)

-Victini
(Coin re-flipper. Without it, you'll have to use Trick Coin, which is harder to use because it is a Tool)
-Emboar
(Same reason as Blastoise)

-Outragers
(They've always been good.)

-Seismitoad/Meloetta EX
(Fun archetype that used to be really fun and affordable. Is not that great anymore, though, because of a lack of Level Ball.)

-Mewtwo-EX
(Infamous for being probably the most broken card for it's era, tying with the Hitmonchan and Luxray GL Lvl. X. Without it, the only other Psychic Type that runs on Colorless to hit for weakness is Starmie.)

-Garbodor
(Mind-bogglingly broken Ability Locker. Without it, the Seismitoad-EX archetype is really dead, outside of Ninetales/Silent Lab.) (Kill it now. Just kill it right now. I can't wait until August for it to rotate, so KILL IT NOW.)

-Terrakion
(Great Type advantage revenger. It's one more Fighting Type that will be missed from the Fighting Archetype.)

-Darkrai-EX
(Undenyably useful Dark-Type that was a deck all of it's own. Without it, Yveltal-EX really doesn't have a great free retreat tech anymore.)

-Zoroark
(Fun combo in Dark decks, though the archetype hasn't been used in a while.)

-Cobalion
(An occasional tech in Metal decks to stall for a turn or two, depending on the match-up.)

-Elesa
(An interesting Supporter that is sometimes used in Tool-heavy decks, like Mega decks.)

 

[Talkingcat]

^ Great list.

I will really miss the Outragers, Keldeo EX and Darkrai EX. Probably the Outragers most of all.