I'm looking forward to the new set, not the new rules. The rare candy Errata really, really annoys me. I also think abilities may make it very confusing. All of this favors SP decks, so I hope this comes in play when the format changes to PL-on (if it does).
(2) New BW Rules, Black and White Collection Images [10/30]
- Thread starter Water Pokémon Master
- Start date
I don't know why people are hating on these new rules so much. I LIKE these new rules.
1. Rare Candy errata
-I'm a player who can't stand donks. I hate the Machop-Fighting-Candy-Machamp thing. The new errata was made to prevent donks, so players that go first and can't play Supporters (they only stated that Trainers can be used on the first turn) can actually play out the game. While BTS is still there, it's nice knowing that Candy is a lost option for donking.
2. Abilities
-If the Pokemon cards were intended to be based off the game, then where did Poke Powers/Bodies come from? Abilities, IMO, fits much more nicely. But other than that, Abilites are pretty much the same thing as Powers and Bodies.
But, as for Trainers on the first turn, I don't like that =0
1. Rare Candy errata
-I'm a player who can't stand donks. I hate the Machop-Fighting-Candy-Machamp thing. The new errata was made to prevent donks, so players that go first and can't play Supporters (they only stated that Trainers can be used on the first turn) can actually play out the game. While BTS is still there, it's nice knowing that Candy is a lost option for donking.
2. Abilities
-If the Pokemon cards were intended to be based off the game, then where did Poke Powers/Bodies come from? Abilities, IMO, fits much more nicely. But other than that, Abilites are pretty much the same thing as Powers and Bodies.
But, as for Trainers on the first turn, I don't like that =0
If you keep in mind Japan new format these rules are actually a nice change to the game. Being HGSS on there is no Broken Time Space or Expert belt to be played first turn. The way the have changed Rare Candy is also a good thing as it has become evident that they are pushing for the one thing this game needed again, slower paced game play. Rare Candy, Claydol, Broken Time Space and SP has made our last formats a faster game than ever before. Gone will be the phrase "It's a Stage 2 Pokemon, it's good but it's just too slow." Also, as for the misconception that Vileplume would lock Trainers, Supporters and Stadiums read the cards again with Japans wording in mind. There are "Trainer's - Goods" and with Japans Vileplume text "Neither player can play any Goods cards from his or her hand."
Everything will be fine if not better with this rule change unless some idiot on our side of the ocean decides to implement these rules within our current format. If that happens I'll ram my head through a wall then grab my LuxChomp deck and be saddened that top 32 at Nationals will be 32 LuxChomp decks.
Everything will be fine if not better with this rule change unless some idiot on our side of the ocean decides to implement these rules within our current format. If that happens I'll ram my head through a wall then grab my LuxChomp deck and be saddened that top 32 at Nationals will be 32 LuxChomp decks.
I have just two things to say on these new rules. (More specifically the Rare Candy rule).
Kingdra, Machamp, and other "donk" card were released in late DP/early Platinum. Nearly everyone complained about how these speed cards "ruined the game" with their insane speed.
Now, PCL tries to fix this by issuing an errata on Rare Candy and allowing Supporters to be played on Turn 1. Now people complain about how this "ruins" Stages 2 or harms the game in general.
The Pokemon fanbase - You can't ever please them.
Anyway, these rules changes will be good as long as both Stormfront and Platinum are rotated...but that is the heart of the issue.
Kingdra, Machamp, and other "donk" card were released in late DP/early Platinum. Nearly everyone complained about how these speed cards "ruined the game" with their insane speed.
Now, PCL tries to fix this by issuing an errata on Rare Candy and allowing Supporters to be played on Turn 1. Now people complain about how this "ruins" Stages 2 or harms the game in general.
The Pokemon fanbase - You can't ever please them.
Anyway, these rules changes will be good as long as both Stormfront and Platinum are rotated...but that is the heart of the issue.
some of the changes are completely pointless.... "Trainer" to "Trainer's." Why?
Seriously? That's what you pick on? Ugh.
I have mixed feeling about these rules. The trainer's first turn is an exciting change, sure to liven up and speed up a game. Donphan will definetly benefit from that. The errata's are little bit strange, especially great ball and plus power. Shuppet finally meets it's ultimate doom, if it hadn't already. Great ball is fine, I guess. A little change never hurt anyone, and very few decks used great ball anyway. Maybe this will bring it back into the light.
Rare Candy is a touchy subject. I don't like it, but i don't hate it. I rarely use Rare Candy on the second turn anyway, so I don't see a change in it for me. Most I'll use it for is Machop to Machamp Prime, on my bench.
Abilities make sense. We are in a completely different region people! There are bound to be changes. Abilities may stop Gengar SF, but he'll be rotated out soon after these rules are implemented. Abilities are very similar anyway, so there is no reason to fret.
Let me say, I love Prof. Araragi. Prof. Oak all over again! This will definetly be a used card. I see some strategy with Pokemon Centre, Jaroda, and Nidoqueen RR. That's 30 damage healed per turn. You can even use the other Jaroda to heal 20 to all your grass types on your attack! Defiantly a tanking deck.
What I'm trying to say is, these rules have a point. TPCi isn't totally stupid, they know what they're doing, even if we don't. We need to embrace these changes and find ways to use them to our advantage. Not just complain.
I have mixed feeling about these rules. The trainer's first turn is an exciting change, sure to liven up and speed up a game. Donphan will definetly benefit from that. The errata's are little bit strange, especially great ball and plus power. Shuppet finally meets it's ultimate doom, if it hadn't already. Great ball is fine, I guess. A little change never hurt anyone, and very few decks used great ball anyway. Maybe this will bring it back into the light.
Rare Candy is a touchy subject. I don't like it, but i don't hate it. I rarely use Rare Candy on the second turn anyway, so I don't see a change in it for me. Most I'll use it for is Machop to Machamp Prime, on my bench.
Abilities make sense. We are in a completely different region people! There are bound to be changes. Abilities may stop Gengar SF, but he'll be rotated out soon after these rules are implemented. Abilities are very similar anyway, so there is no reason to fret.
Let me say, I love Prof. Araragi. Prof. Oak all over again! This will definetly be a used card. I see some strategy with Pokemon Centre, Jaroda, and Nidoqueen RR. That's 30 damage healed per turn. You can even use the other Jaroda to heal 20 to all your grass types on your attack! Defiantly a tanking deck.
What I'm trying to say is, these rules have a point. TPCi isn't totally stupid, they know what they're doing, even if we don't. We need to embrace these changes and find ways to use them to our advantage. Not just complain.
I love this quote. <3 <3STEREOCHILD said:
God, that rule makes Vileplume and Spiritomb just BROKEN. Looks like I'm building my SD!Main Page said:
And, who thinks that this is the next Nidoqueen? And, it STACKS!!! And, Dialga G Lv.X doesn't block it! (as far as I can tell)Jalorda said:
EDIT: Ninja'd
Abilities condensing PokePowers and PokeBodies is kinda gross to me, but I guess it makes some Pokemon's attacks better. It's just like a long time ago when Pokemon Powers existed. They're nice, and Goop Gas Attack effects would be greatly welcomed.
Trainers turn one? No evolving early? So much more "Who goes first? Oh, me? Awesome." At least it's not like that with donk decks. "Who goes second? Oh, me? Awesome." It doesn't sound too bad to me. It's just a little different. The person who goes first now gets an energy attachment advantage AND speed advantage, but no evos. Second person doesn't get an evolution anymore. First player's second turn gives them 2 energy and evolution. Second player must counter. Unlike the old "I go first and pass. I go second and donk." Poor spiritomb, though. I also pray for no Return of the Shuppet.
Trainer's cards? Gross. I don't like roleplaying anymore.
Support cards? I guess not all of them will have some character doing something for you anymore.
~L_X_F
Trainers turn one? No evolving early? So much more "Who goes first? Oh, me? Awesome." At least it's not like that with donk decks. "Who goes second? Oh, me? Awesome." It doesn't sound too bad to me. It's just a little different. The person who goes first now gets an energy attachment advantage AND speed advantage, but no evos. Second person doesn't get an evolution anymore. First player's second turn gives them 2 energy and evolution. Second player must counter. Unlike the old "I go first and pass. I go second and donk." Poor spiritomb, though. I also pray for no Return of the Shuppet.
Trainer's cards? Gross. I don't like roleplaying anymore.
Support cards? I guess not all of them will have some character doing something for you anymore.
~L_X_F
1) Some of you should be thinking about how we're going to play with these rules HGSS-on. Never mind BTS or the Machop-RareCandy-Machamp-etc donks, because you won't be playing against these donks or with BTS (or any before-HGSS cards) when these rules come out. i.e. these rules won't help SP because HGSS-on, there isn't any SP!
2) I wonder if they're going to errata Jalorda to be like Nidoqueen where you can't stack the powers...otherwise that'd be rather broken x-x
2) I wonder if they're going to errata Jalorda to be like Nidoqueen where you can't stack the powers...otherwise that'd be rather broken x-x
Wonder why they merged the Black and White colors on the border to make it gray?? I thought they would have did it like HeartGold and SoulSilver sets border, and have both colors of the games on the border but instead, they completely merged the colors! Maybe the third version will be Pokemon Gray. Then again there doing gray this early, maybe there will be a completely different version for the third version.
This is interesting to say the least. I knew something this huge was coming and what do I find...Another Trainer ruling setting it back to RS Trainer mechanics...
that's just kinda funny.
Anyway 'Abilities are probably a way to condense and clean up the terminology for newer player, and it easily has little importance to the game-state at this time, though they currently have nothing to counter them and will probably be very handy when they are released.
Trainers now include Supporters, Goods, and Stadiums, is a change I thought may occur, and it was probably done so they could make more massive references, as for what time will only tell. Normally I would be against this as it blurs the line and would force one to read the small text at the top right, but they have color-coordinated them to fix the problem. Furthermore we now have turn one Trainers, which is definitely going to be fun. I've missed being able to play Trainers first turn especially with a lot of decks assuring a T2 Spiritomb so this definitely interests me.
The errata regarding Rare Candy definitely has its purpose (to stop donks) but I'll definitely miss it, and it will give an advantage to snipe decks, but that's fine.
The errata regarding Great Ball is interesting. Where I never would have cared about this change they decided to turn it into a new Master Ball, so does that mean we'll get a new Master Ball with a bigger better effect?
Lastly there are obviously those who are bitter about this especially, because of SP, but we don't know when everywhere else will be affected, and we don't know what else will be released that may help the meta. I for one am looking forward to what they reveal and am psyched for these new changes.
that's just kinda funny.Anyway 'Abilities are probably a way to condense and clean up the terminology for newer player, and it easily has little importance to the game-state at this time, though they currently have nothing to counter them and will probably be very handy when they are released.
Trainers now include Supporters, Goods, and Stadiums, is a change I thought may occur, and it was probably done so they could make more massive references, as for what time will only tell. Normally I would be against this as it blurs the line and would force one to read the small text at the top right, but they have color-coordinated them to fix the problem. Furthermore we now have turn one Trainers, which is definitely going to be fun. I've missed being able to play Trainers first turn especially with a lot of decks assuring a T2 Spiritomb so this definitely interests me.
The errata regarding Rare Candy definitely has its purpose (to stop donks) but I'll definitely miss it, and it will give an advantage to snipe decks, but that's fine.
The errata regarding Great Ball is interesting. Where I never would have cared about this change they decided to turn it into a new Master Ball, so does that mean we'll get a new Master Ball with a bigger better effect?
Lastly there are obviously those who are bitter about this especially, because of SP, but we don't know when everywhere else will be affected, and we don't know what else will be released that may help the meta. I for one am looking forward to what they reveal and am psyched for these new changes.
Some of the changes are good some are bad but why oh why are they changing potions to heal 30 damage.
One of my main concerns about all this is that most of the players in my metagame might quit the TCG due to these new rulings and erratas. I'd hate to see that seeing as how there's not very many active TCG/CCG's currently other than Magic: The Gathering and Yu-Gi-Oh!
The Pokemon TCG is one of the best games I've played since I started playing Magic back in 2002 and I'm not giving up on the game because of what's going on. To me it's not nearly as bad as some people make it out to be, I'm fine with it as long as my friends are fine with it (hopefully).
I guess we'll have to wait and see what TPCi on the English side says about all this but as of right now our format is still Majestic Dawn-On, we're still rotating 4 sets a year, and I don't expect a Mid-Season Rotation before Worlds 2011 cause that would cause another schizm to the game itself thus creating more problems than solving them.
We still haven't gotten HS Triumphant yet, I still haven't gotten my booster box of the new set, and as far as I'm concerned in regards to the Pokemon TCG the sky isn't falling nor is it the end of the world. I still can't believe Japan would pull a 180 like this just to cause a bunch of hysteria and support a format that's suitable for themselves.
The Pokemon TCG is one of the best games I've played since I started playing Magic back in 2002 and I'm not giving up on the game because of what's going on. To me it's not nearly as bad as some people make it out to be, I'm fine with it as long as my friends are fine with it (hopefully).
I guess we'll have to wait and see what TPCi on the English side says about all this but as of right now our format is still Majestic Dawn-On, we're still rotating 4 sets a year, and I don't expect a Mid-Season Rotation before Worlds 2011 cause that would cause another schizm to the game itself thus creating more problems than solving them.
We still haven't gotten HS Triumphant yet, I still haven't gotten my booster box of the new set, and as far as I'm concerned in regards to the Pokemon TCG the sky isn't falling nor is it the end of the world. I still can't believe Japan would pull a 180 like this just to cause a bunch of hysteria and support a format that's suitable for themselves.
Ok, I'm not that active on Pokebeach anymore, but I still check for new news. And now I need a place to rant. So rant I will.
WHAT HAVE THE JAPANESE DONE!!! No, seriously, they've just gotten rid of the whole point of Rare Candy. No more T2 Speedra, or Gengar/Machamp. And of course they had to confuse Trainers and Trainer's and Supports and Supporters! GAAAAAAAH!
SHARONNNNNNNN! I'M SO CONFUSEDDDDDDDDD![/ozzyosbornerant]
Thank you.
WHAT HAVE THE JAPANESE DONE!!! No, seriously, they've just gotten rid of the whole point of Rare Candy. No more T2 Speedra, or Gengar/Machamp. And of course they had to confuse Trainers and Trainer's and Supports and Supporters! GAAAAAAAH!
SHARONNNNNNNN! I'M SO CONFUSEDDDDDDDDD![/ozzyosbornerant]
Thank you.
If they want to prevent donks, so be it but they must also put in factor of Shuppet donks again and Sableye now can donk and hit 70 a turn because it can play Expert Belt first turn.I am happy if they don't change the rulings until after Worlds 2011
STEREOCHILD said:
THANK YOU for saying that. I'm so sick of seeing so many complaints about these new rules, so I'm glad that I'm not the only one that is looking at it the same way you are.
These rule changes aren't intended to affect DP/Pt sets. They're meant to target HGSS sets and onward. Even IF SPs survive the weird rotation here in the US next format, they'll lose a TON of valuable support that Pt has given them, and bear in mind that if they stick to their claim about rotating 4-sets at a time, that will mean that Pt WILL be rotated, meaning no more Sprays, Energy Gain, Poketurn, Crobat Gs, Dialga G (and its Lv X), etc, and don't forget that BTS will be gone, too. Luxchomp will struggle to stay afloat without all of the glory that the SP engine gave them.
Personally, I'm not an SP fan, but even IF the rules are implemented here in the US when the nationals and worlds come, it'll only be for a brief time that they can truely shine and give SP-lovers one last moment to savior their legacy before they begin their drastic decline in the next format. That's when the new rules will really become our friends much more than our enemies.
So to everyone complaining over how broken SPs will become, please stop. For one, we don't know whether or not these rules will even MAKE it to our format's nationals and/or worlds. If they do, THEN you might have a mild case to uphold, but even then, complaining won't change anything. All you can do is adapt. We don't even know many cards from BW yet, and for all we know, they could hold a promising way to counter them (or do I need to remind everyone about how Vileplume has made SPs struggle, even if only a little bit).
So in conclusion, don't jump to sudden negative conclusions about the new rules when they haven't even been implemented here yet. We're not even halfway into our OWN format's season. ANY NUMBER of things can change AT ANY TIME. Besides, despite how I'm an SP-hater, I love how they push the limits of non-SP decks. I love the challange and the thrill of facing such a tough, popular deck archetype with a deck that I put my heart and creativeness into building. I only wish many other players thought of this the way I do. This is a GAME, after all, not a "the fate of the world depends on a children's card game" situation like you see in the Yu-gi-oh anime all the time.
That's my rant / two cents.