Blob55 said:
I didn't say you were. I meant that you should add other Pokemon that would fix type and variety problems first, then include some of those. Those are all good Pokemon, but there are others that I'd rather see more.
ORAS Changes to the Hoenn Pokédex?
- Thread starter Meaty
- Start date
I didn't say you were. I meant that you should add other Pokemon that would fix type and variety problems first, then include some of those. Those are all good Pokemon, but there are others that I'd rather see more.
Bolt the Cat said:
Right, Victory road, cave of origin, and south of Mt.Pyre.
Throwing more pseudos in feels so overdone (especially Deino), same with Axew-line..so idk. Depends on how they change the interiors visually too.
The sky tower could use something new too, more akin to the rare Altaria encounters, instead of just ghosts and Claydol.
Mitja said:
Hm. Well I was thinking Druddigon, but he's sort of overdone as well. One time a while back I had the idea to put the Mienfoo line in Sky Pillar, that might work. I was also thinking Excadrill for Victory Road, but Victory Road could probably use some Pokemon that aren't generic cave dwellers. IDK, I've been thinking about this issue as well and I wasn't really thinking in terms of which Pokemon have been overused all that much.
EDIT: Speaking of which, I should post mine. I'm still thinking this through a bit, but this is more or less what I'd want in a Dex expansion:
New Hoenn Dex (New Ones in Bold):
1. Treecko
2. Grovyle
3. Sceptile
4. Torchic
5. Combusken
6. Blaziken
7. Mudkip
8. Marshtomp
9. Swampert
10. Poochyena
11. Mightyena
12. Zigzagoon
13. Linoone
14. Rattata
15. Raticate
16. Wurmple
17. Silcoon
18. Beautifly
19. Cascoon
20. Dustox
21. Lotad
22. Lombre
23. Ludicolo
24. Seedot
25. Nuzleaf
26. Shiftry
27. Taillow
28. Swellow
29. Wingull
30. Pelipper
31. Ralts
32. Kirlia
33. Gardevoir
34. Gallade
35. Surskit
36. Masquerain
37. Azurill
38. Marill
39. Azumarill
40. Budew
41. Roselia
42. Roserade
43. Shroomish
44. Breloom
45. Slakoth
46. Vigoroth
47. Slaking
48. Cottonee
49. Whimsicott
50. Petilil
51. Lilligant
52. Geodude
53. Graveler
54. Golem
55. Nosepass
56. Probopass
57. Abra
58. Kadabra
59. Alakazam
60. Nincada
61. Ninjask
62. Shedinja
63. Skitty
64. Delcatty
65. Zubat
66. Golbat
67. Crobat
68. Whismur
69. Loudred
70. Exploud
71. Chingling
72. Chimecho
73. Machop
74. Machoke
75. Machamp
76. Meditite
77. Medicham
78. Makuhita
79. Hariyama
80. Mankey
81. Primeape
82. Sableye
83. Mawile
84. Aron
85. Lairon
86. Aggron
87. Dwebble
88. Crustle
89. Magikarp
90. Gyarados
91. Goldeen
92. Seaking
93. Poliwag
94. Poliwhirl
95. Poliwrath
96. Politoed
97. Tentacool
98. Tentacruel
99. Shellos
100. Gastrodon
101. Vanillite
102. Vanillish
103. Vanilluxe
104. Electrike
105. Manectric
106. Plusle
107. Minun
108. Magby
109. Magmar
110. Magmortar
111. Elekid
112. Electabuzz
113. Electivire
114. Magnemite
115. Magneton
116. Magnezone
117. Voltorb
118. Electrode
119. Joltik
120. Galvantula
121. Klink
122. Klang
123. Klinklang
124. Rotom
125. Oddish
126. Gloom
127. Vileplume
128. Bellosom
129. Gulpin
130. Swalot
131. Volbeat
132. Illumise
133. Doduo
134. Dodrio
135. Cherubi
136. Cherrim
137. Togepi
138. Togetic
139. Togekiss
140. Carvanha
141. Sharpedo
142. Wailmer
143. Waillord
144. Numel
145. Camerupt
146. Vulpix
147. Ninetales
148. Growlithe
149. Arcanine
150. Bagon
151. Shelgon
152. Salamence
153. Slugma
154. Magcargo
155. Torkoal
156. Grimer
157. Muk
158. Koffing
159. Weezing
160. Sandshrew
161. Sandslash
162. Spinda
163. Darumaka
164. Darmanitan
165. Spoink
166. Grumpig
167. Skarmory
168. Swablu
169. Altaria
170. Zangoose
171. Seviper
172. Barboach
173. Whiscash
174. Lunatone
175. Solrock
176. Beldum
177. Metang
178. Metagross
179. Trapinch
180. Vibrava
181. Flygon
182. Cacnea
183. Cacturne
184. Gible
185. Gabite
186. Garchomp
187. Baltoy
188. Claydol
189. Lileep
190. Cradily
191. Anorith
192. Armaldo
193. Igglybuff
194. Jigglypuff
195. Wigglytuff
196. Cleffa
197. Clefairy
198. Clefable
199. Corphish
200. Crawdaunt
201. Frillish
202. Jellicent
203. Inkay
204. Malamar
205. Croagunk
206. Toxicroak
207. Kricketot
208. Kricketune
209. Tropius
210. Feebas
211. Milotic
212. Castform
213. Kecleon
214. Larvesta
215. Volcarona
216. Pichu
217. Pikachu
218. Raichu
219. Psyduck
220. Golduck
221. Wynaut
222. Wobbuffet
223. Natu
224. Xatu
225. Girafarig
226. Stantler
227. Aipom
228. Ambipom
229. Phanpy
230. Donphan
231. Pinsir
232. Heracross
233. Rhyhorn
234. Rhydon
235. Rhyperior
236. Shuppet
237. Banette
238. Duskull
239. Dusclops
240. Dusknoir
241. Litwick
242. Lampent
243. Chandelure
244. Misdreavus
245. Mismagius
246. Absol
247. Flabebe
248. Floette
249. Florges
250. Staryu
251. Starmie
252. Remoraid
253. Octillery
254. Mantyke
255. Mantine
256. Spheal
257. Sealeo
258. Walrein
259. Cubchoo
260. Beartic
261. Smoochum
262. Jynx
263. Snorunt
264. Glalie
265. Froslass
266. Lapras
267. Clamperl
268. Huntail
269. Gorebyss
270. Chinchou
271. Lanturn
272. Finneon
273. Lumineon
274. Skrelp
275. Dragalge
276. Clauncher
277. Clawitzer
278. Relicanth
279. Tynamo
280. Eelektrik
281. Eelektross
282. Shuckle
283. Corsola
284. Horsea
285. Seadra
286. Kingdra
287. Luvdisc
288. Carbink
289. Druddigon
290. Drillbur
291. Excadrill
292. Regice
293. Regirock
294. Registeel
295. Regigigas
296. Latias
297. Latios
298. Kyogre
299. Groudon
300. Rayquaza
301. Jirachi
302. Deoxys
First of all, Dusknoir pretty much confirms cross gen evos, so they're as good as in now. Maybe Regigigas too because it has a strong connection to Hoenn's lore with the other Regis. So in my mind, the first order of business is to take care of type distribution. The types most in need of new members are Ice (Walrein, Glalie, Froslass) Ghost (Shedinja, Sableye, Banette, Dusknoir), Dragon (Flygon, Altaria, Kingdra, Salamence), and Fairy (Gardevoir, Azumarill, Mawile, and Wigglytuff). So I went through and added Pokemon that have both been underused lately and fit Hoenn's environments. I came up with the following:
Ice:
Vanillite/Vanillish/Vanilluxe
Lapras
Cubchoo/Beartic
Smoochum/Jynx
Nearly all of the Ice types in existence appeared in XY in either Frost Cavern or Rt. 17, so it's more a matter of which ones fit Hoenn than which ones are underused. The Vanillite line makes sense for a tropical region, plus it would make a great gift Pokemon which would make it suitable for an early game appearance (I'm thinking Seashore House on Rt. 109). Lapras is a natural fit for Hoenn, with tons of Water routes, there's plenty of places for it to show up (although I was thinking Rt. 125/Shoal Cave to vary the distribution a bit). And then the Cubchoo line fits Shoal Cave pretty well, it's a cave dwelling Pokemon and Beartic has a loose connection to water, so it makes sense to see one in a seaside ice cave. And then there's Jynx, who is one of the most underused Ice types in the series (also I'm anticipating a Mega Evolution).
Ghost:
Frillish/Jellicent
Litwick/Lampent/Chandelure
Misdreavus/Mismagius
Most of these guys are Pokemon that didn't show up at all in XY. First, I think there is no new family more deserving of a spot than the Frillish line, on top of adding variety and being unavailable to XY, it also fits Hoenn very well and adds variety to some areas that could really need it (like Rt. 122 and Abandoned Ship). And then there's Misdreavus, which was the other Ghost that didn't show up in XY, which would be a good fit for Mt. Pyre. Lastly is the Litwick line, which just fits Mt. Pyre really well.
Dragon:
Gible/Gabite/Garchomp
Druddigon
All of the Dragon types that currently exist are obtainable in XY (and in fact they're all in the Kalos Dex, so all of them have been used recently), so it's a matter of picking ones that fit. Gible fits the land theme of the games, so I chose that. And then I wanted at least one more, but I didn't want to prioritize a pseudo legend or a 6th gen Dragon, so that left me with Druddigon, which fits a couple of late game areas like Victory Road and Sky Pillar anyway.
Fairy:
Cleffa/Clefairy/Clefable
Togepi/Togetic/Togekiss
Cottonee/Whimsicott
Okay, so we just got Fairy as a new type in XY, but they didn't get to show off all of them, a few of them were post game Friend Safari Pokemon that weren't really showcased in the main storyline. So what better time than now? It helps promote the type and breathes new life into these Pokemon. As for where, I think Clefairy is good for somewhere in the Meteor Falls area (I was thinking Rt. 115), Togepi could show up just about anywhere but I'm thinking Rt. 117, and Cottonee is good for grassy areas like Petalburg Woods and Rt. 123. I was also thinking for Cottonee to make it version exclusive with Petilil, since Mawile is a version exclusive Fairy, it would be fair to put Cottonee in Alpha Sapphire.
So after that was done, I took a look at some of the areas that could use distribution improvements. Of note are the following problems:
-Rusturf Tunnel is nothing but Whismur.
-Not enough Rock Smash Pokemon. I mean, there's not a whole lot you can expect for Rock Smash Pokemon, but they should at least have more than Geodude line and the occasional Nosepass.
-New Mauville is a Voltorb/Magnemite fest.
-Rt. 112, Rt. 113, and Jagged Pass only have 2 or 3 Pokemon each.
-Scorched Slab is a pointless area
-Rt. 123 has nothing unique
-Water areas are Tentacool/Wingull fests.
-Seafloor Cavern is a Zubat/Golbat fest.
-Cave of Origin has nothing unique.
-Victory Road has too many NFE Pokemon.
So here's what I did to fix those issues:
-Zubat and Chingling added to Rusturf Tunnel. Chingling needed a good place to appear anyway because Chimecho is too freaking rare for such a mediocre Pokemon, and since Chingling is going to be in anyway, they may as well make it catchable. Zubat is just because it fits the environment.
-Like I said, not much they can add for Rock Smash, but there's a few Pokemon they can add such as Dwebble. They can also stand to make Nosepass a bit more common, like in Victory Road.
-Joltik, Klink, and Rotom added to New Mauville. This might be a little overkill, but they're all unique species and type combinations.
-For the Mt. Chimney area, I added 2 or 3 more Pokemon each so that they have much fuller distributions, but they each have some unique species. For Rt. 112 I now have Machop, Numel, Growlithe/Vulpix, Mankey, and Bagon. Rt. 113 I have Spinda, Sandshrew, Numel, Growlithe/Vulpix, Darumaka, and Skarmory. And for Jagged Pass I have Machop, Numel, Spoink, and Bagon. Growlithe was added for balancing purposes, I put him in to form a version exclusive pair with Vulpix. Mankey is for extra Fighting type diversity, and because it's underused both in 6th gen and overall (the last time it appeared in a regional dex was Johto, and they automatically added all of the 1st gen Pokemon there anyway). Bagon is a result of another design decision I chose, since Metagross has a Mega Evolution and we'll probably be getting the Mega Stone from that Beldum we get post game, we can afford to have Beldum earlier in the game. So I'm thinking move Beldum to Meteor Falls, and then move Bagon somewhere else so that the pseudo legends aren't too clustered. So Rt. 112 and Jagged Pass sound like good places for it to appear. Lastly, Darumaka isn't in XY, so it was added to make it more available.
-There's only one thing in my mind that can really fix Scorched Slab, and that's making an overworld encounter for Volcarona. Pretty obvious solution, really.
-Cottonee/Petilil can go right into Rt. 123, but what it really needs is an exclusive Pokemon, and any grassy Pokemon works. I chose Floette, which gives us a bonus Fairy to the game.
-There's definitely some sea dwelling Pokemon they can throw a few more in to make them more varied. Gastrodon is a natural choice for Hoenn, and it could possibly show up in a few water routes. Everything else is basically a matter of which ones fit. I chose Remoraid and Mantine, those are the only sea route Pokemon I could think of that would add diversity. Someone on Serebii also suggested Inkay, and I liked the idea, so I went with that. Now, I don't think they can make every single route unique, there's way too many of them. But they can mix things up a bit by staggering the distributions, so for instance Gastrodon could go in some of the routes that are either close to land or are dotted with islands (Rt. 105-109, Rt. 115, Rt. 124, Rt. 125, Rt. 127-130), Inkay can go on Rt. 129-131, 132-134, and Abandoned Ship, and Remoraid/Mantine on Rt. 124-130. That way it won't feel like you're encountering the same Pokemon on all of the Surfing areas.
-Eelektrik is shown to appear in areas like Seafloor Cavern, and since it's unavailable in XY anyway, it would be unique. They can further flesh out the distribution here with Crustle, Golduck, and Poliwhirl. They can also put Shuckle in Rock Smash boulders.
-Carbink is the only Pokemon I can think of for Cave of Origin.
-I'm having trouble figuring out what to put in Victory Road. What I did was drop the NFEs, and add Excadrill, Druddigon, Gabite, and Shelgon, but Mitja is right, this is kinda overdone. Not really sure what else to put here either.
Then there was a few other miscellaneous things I wanted to take care of for distribution and accessibility:
-Rattata for Rt. 101-104 and Rt. 116, and Raticate for Rt. 120 and Rt. 121.
-Poliwag and Poliwhirl for various fishing and a few Surfing areas.
-Magby/Elekid as version exclusives for Rt. 110, and then on Rt. 121 Magmar/Electabuzz.
-Cherubi/Cherrim for Rt. 117.
-Croagunk for Rt. 118, and then later Croagunk and Toxicroak in the Safari Zone.
-Kricketune for Rt. 119.
-Stantler and Aipom for the Safari Zone
-Finneon, Skrelp, and Clauncher for Underwater.
And then there was a couple of non-expansion related distribution changes I wanted as well:
-Move Meditite to Granite Cave and then replace it on Mt. Pyre with Medicham (I have no idea why they make us wait so late in the game for Meditite).
-Move Absol from Rt. 120 to Mt. Pyre (makes more sense).
1. Treecko
2. Grovyle
3. Sceptile
4. Torchic
5. Combusken
6. Blaziken
7. Mudkip
8. Marshtomp
9. Swampert
10. Poochyena
11. Mightyena
12. Zigzagoon
13. Linoone
14. Rattata
15. Raticate
16. Wurmple
17. Silcoon
18. Beautifly
19. Cascoon
20. Dustox
21. Lotad
22. Lombre
23. Ludicolo
24. Seedot
25. Nuzleaf
26. Shiftry
27. Taillow
28. Swellow
29. Wingull
30. Pelipper
31. Ralts
32. Kirlia
33. Gardevoir
34. Gallade
35. Surskit
36. Masquerain
37. Azurill
38. Marill
39. Azumarill
40. Budew
41. Roselia
42. Roserade
43. Shroomish
44. Breloom
45. Slakoth
46. Vigoroth
47. Slaking
48. Cottonee
49. Whimsicott
50. Petilil
51. Lilligant
52. Geodude
53. Graveler
54. Golem
55. Nosepass
56. Probopass
57. Abra
58. Kadabra
59. Alakazam
60. Nincada
61. Ninjask
62. Shedinja
63. Skitty
64. Delcatty
65. Zubat
66. Golbat
67. Crobat
68. Whismur
69. Loudred
70. Exploud
71. Chingling
72. Chimecho
73. Machop
74. Machoke
75. Machamp
76. Meditite
77. Medicham
78. Makuhita
79. Hariyama
80. Mankey
81. Primeape
82. Sableye
83. Mawile
84. Aron
85. Lairon
86. Aggron
87. Dwebble
88. Crustle
89. Magikarp
90. Gyarados
91. Goldeen
92. Seaking
93. Poliwag
94. Poliwhirl
95. Poliwrath
96. Politoed
97. Tentacool
98. Tentacruel
99. Shellos
100. Gastrodon
101. Vanillite
102. Vanillish
103. Vanilluxe
104. Electrike
105. Manectric
106. Plusle
107. Minun
108. Magby
109. Magmar
110. Magmortar
111. Elekid
112. Electabuzz
113. Electivire
114. Magnemite
115. Magneton
116. Magnezone
117. Voltorb
118. Electrode
119. Joltik
120. Galvantula
121. Klink
122. Klang
123. Klinklang
124. Rotom
125. Oddish
126. Gloom
127. Vileplume
128. Bellosom
129. Gulpin
130. Swalot
131. Volbeat
132. Illumise
133. Doduo
134. Dodrio
135. Cherubi
136. Cherrim
137. Togepi
138. Togetic
139. Togekiss
140. Carvanha
141. Sharpedo
142. Wailmer
143. Waillord
144. Numel
145. Camerupt
146. Vulpix
147. Ninetales
148. Growlithe
149. Arcanine
150. Bagon
151. Shelgon
152. Salamence
153. Slugma
154. Magcargo
155. Torkoal
156. Grimer
157. Muk
158. Koffing
159. Weezing
160. Sandshrew
161. Sandslash
162. Spinda
163. Darumaka
164. Darmanitan
165. Spoink
166. Grumpig
167. Skarmory
168. Swablu
169. Altaria
170. Zangoose
171. Seviper
172. Barboach
173. Whiscash
174. Lunatone
175. Solrock
176. Beldum
177. Metang
178. Metagross
179. Trapinch
180. Vibrava
181. Flygon
182. Cacnea
183. Cacturne
184. Gible
185. Gabite
186. Garchomp
187. Baltoy
188. Claydol
189. Lileep
190. Cradily
191. Anorith
192. Armaldo
193. Igglybuff
194. Jigglypuff
195. Wigglytuff
196. Cleffa
197. Clefairy
198. Clefable
199. Corphish
200. Crawdaunt
201. Frillish
202. Jellicent
203. Inkay
204. Malamar
205. Croagunk
206. Toxicroak
207. Kricketot
208. Kricketune
209. Tropius
210. Feebas
211. Milotic
212. Castform
213. Kecleon
214. Larvesta
215. Volcarona
216. Pichu
217. Pikachu
218. Raichu
219. Psyduck
220. Golduck
221. Wynaut
222. Wobbuffet
223. Natu
224. Xatu
225. Girafarig
226. Stantler
227. Aipom
228. Ambipom
229. Phanpy
230. Donphan
231. Pinsir
232. Heracross
233. Rhyhorn
234. Rhydon
235. Rhyperior
236. Shuppet
237. Banette
238. Duskull
239. Dusclops
240. Dusknoir
241. Litwick
242. Lampent
243. Chandelure
244. Misdreavus
245. Mismagius
246. Absol
247. Flabebe
248. Floette
249. Florges
250. Staryu
251. Starmie
252. Remoraid
253. Octillery
254. Mantyke
255. Mantine
256. Spheal
257. Sealeo
258. Walrein
259. Cubchoo
260. Beartic
261. Smoochum
262. Jynx
263. Snorunt
264. Glalie
265. Froslass
266. Lapras
267. Clamperl
268. Huntail
269. Gorebyss
270. Chinchou
271. Lanturn
272. Finneon
273. Lumineon
274. Skrelp
275. Dragalge
276. Clauncher
277. Clawitzer
278. Relicanth
279. Tynamo
280. Eelektrik
281. Eelektross
282. Shuckle
283. Corsola
284. Horsea
285. Seadra
286. Kingdra
287. Luvdisc
288. Carbink
289. Druddigon
290. Drillbur
291. Excadrill
292. Regice
293. Regirock
294. Registeel
295. Regigigas
296. Latias
297. Latios
298. Kyogre
299. Groudon
300. Rayquaza
301. Jirachi
302. Deoxys
First of all, Dusknoir pretty much confirms cross gen evos, so they're as good as in now. Maybe Regigigas too because it has a strong connection to Hoenn's lore with the other Regis. So in my mind, the first order of business is to take care of type distribution. The types most in need of new members are Ice (Walrein, Glalie, Froslass) Ghost (Shedinja, Sableye, Banette, Dusknoir), Dragon (Flygon, Altaria, Kingdra, Salamence), and Fairy (Gardevoir, Azumarill, Mawile, and Wigglytuff). So I went through and added Pokemon that have both been underused lately and fit Hoenn's environments. I came up with the following:
Ice:
Vanillite/Vanillish/Vanilluxe
Lapras
Cubchoo/Beartic
Smoochum/Jynx
Nearly all of the Ice types in existence appeared in XY in either Frost Cavern or Rt. 17, so it's more a matter of which ones fit Hoenn than which ones are underused. The Vanillite line makes sense for a tropical region, plus it would make a great gift Pokemon which would make it suitable for an early game appearance (I'm thinking Seashore House on Rt. 109). Lapras is a natural fit for Hoenn, with tons of Water routes, there's plenty of places for it to show up (although I was thinking Rt. 125/Shoal Cave to vary the distribution a bit). And then the Cubchoo line fits Shoal Cave pretty well, it's a cave dwelling Pokemon and Beartic has a loose connection to water, so it makes sense to see one in a seaside ice cave. And then there's Jynx, who is one of the most underused Ice types in the series (also I'm anticipating a Mega Evolution).
Ghost:
Frillish/Jellicent
Litwick/Lampent/Chandelure
Misdreavus/Mismagius
Most of these guys are Pokemon that didn't show up at all in XY. First, I think there is no new family more deserving of a spot than the Frillish line, on top of adding variety and being unavailable to XY, it also fits Hoenn very well and adds variety to some areas that could really need it (like Rt. 122 and Abandoned Ship). And then there's Misdreavus, which was the other Ghost that didn't show up in XY, which would be a good fit for Mt. Pyre. Lastly is the Litwick line, which just fits Mt. Pyre really well.
Dragon:
Gible/Gabite/Garchomp
Druddigon
All of the Dragon types that currently exist are obtainable in XY (and in fact they're all in the Kalos Dex, so all of them have been used recently), so it's a matter of picking ones that fit. Gible fits the land theme of the games, so I chose that. And then I wanted at least one more, but I didn't want to prioritize a pseudo legend or a 6th gen Dragon, so that left me with Druddigon, which fits a couple of late game areas like Victory Road and Sky Pillar anyway.
Fairy:
Cleffa/Clefairy/Clefable
Togepi/Togetic/Togekiss
Cottonee/Whimsicott
Okay, so we just got Fairy as a new type in XY, but they didn't get to show off all of them, a few of them were post game Friend Safari Pokemon that weren't really showcased in the main storyline. So what better time than now? It helps promote the type and breathes new life into these Pokemon. As for where, I think Clefairy is good for somewhere in the Meteor Falls area (I was thinking Rt. 115), Togepi could show up just about anywhere but I'm thinking Rt. 117, and Cottonee is good for grassy areas like Petalburg Woods and Rt. 123. I was also thinking for Cottonee to make it version exclusive with Petilil, since Mawile is a version exclusive Fairy, it would be fair to put Cottonee in Alpha Sapphire.
So after that was done, I took a look at some of the areas that could use distribution improvements. Of note are the following problems:
-Rusturf Tunnel is nothing but Whismur.
-Not enough Rock Smash Pokemon. I mean, there's not a whole lot you can expect for Rock Smash Pokemon, but they should at least have more than Geodude line and the occasional Nosepass.
-New Mauville is a Voltorb/Magnemite fest.
-Rt. 112, Rt. 113, and Jagged Pass only have 2 or 3 Pokemon each.
-Scorched Slab is a pointless area
-Rt. 123 has nothing unique
-Water areas are Tentacool/Wingull fests.
-Seafloor Cavern is a Zubat/Golbat fest.
-Cave of Origin has nothing unique.
-Victory Road has too many NFE Pokemon.
So here's what I did to fix those issues:
-Zubat and Chingling added to Rusturf Tunnel. Chingling needed a good place to appear anyway because Chimecho is too freaking rare for such a mediocre Pokemon, and since Chingling is going to be in anyway, they may as well make it catchable. Zubat is just because it fits the environment.
-Like I said, not much they can add for Rock Smash, but there's a few Pokemon they can add such as Dwebble. They can also stand to make Nosepass a bit more common, like in Victory Road.
-Joltik, Klink, and Rotom added to New Mauville. This might be a little overkill, but they're all unique species and type combinations.
-For the Mt. Chimney area, I added 2 or 3 more Pokemon each so that they have much fuller distributions, but they each have some unique species. For Rt. 112 I now have Machop, Numel, Growlithe/Vulpix, Mankey, and Bagon. Rt. 113 I have Spinda, Sandshrew, Numel, Growlithe/Vulpix, Darumaka, and Skarmory. And for Jagged Pass I have Machop, Numel, Spoink, and Bagon. Growlithe was added for balancing purposes, I put him in to form a version exclusive pair with Vulpix. Mankey is for extra Fighting type diversity, and because it's underused both in 6th gen and overall (the last time it appeared in a regional dex was Johto, and they automatically added all of the 1st gen Pokemon there anyway). Bagon is a result of another design decision I chose, since Metagross has a Mega Evolution and we'll probably be getting the Mega Stone from that Beldum we get post game, we can afford to have Beldum earlier in the game. So I'm thinking move Beldum to Meteor Falls, and then move Bagon somewhere else so that the pseudo legends aren't too clustered. So Rt. 112 and Jagged Pass sound like good places for it to appear. Lastly, Darumaka isn't in XY, so it was added to make it more available.
-There's only one thing in my mind that can really fix Scorched Slab, and that's making an overworld encounter for Volcarona. Pretty obvious solution, really.
-Cottonee/Petilil can go right into Rt. 123, but what it really needs is an exclusive Pokemon, and any grassy Pokemon works. I chose Floette, which gives us a bonus Fairy to the game.
-There's definitely some sea dwelling Pokemon they can throw a few more in to make them more varied. Gastrodon is a natural choice for Hoenn, and it could possibly show up in a few water routes. Everything else is basically a matter of which ones fit. I chose Remoraid and Mantine, those are the only sea route Pokemon I could think of that would add diversity. Someone on Serebii also suggested Inkay, and I liked the idea, so I went with that. Now, I don't think they can make every single route unique, there's way too many of them. But they can mix things up a bit by staggering the distributions, so for instance Gastrodon could go in some of the routes that are either close to land or are dotted with islands (Rt. 105-109, Rt. 115, Rt. 124, Rt. 125, Rt. 127-130), Inkay can go on Rt. 129-131, 132-134, and Abandoned Ship, and Remoraid/Mantine on Rt. 124-130. That way it won't feel like you're encountering the same Pokemon on all of the Surfing areas.
-Eelektrik is shown to appear in areas like Seafloor Cavern, and since it's unavailable in XY anyway, it would be unique. They can further flesh out the distribution here with Crustle, Golduck, and Poliwhirl. They can also put Shuckle in Rock Smash boulders.
-Carbink is the only Pokemon I can think of for Cave of Origin.
-I'm having trouble figuring out what to put in Victory Road. What I did was drop the NFEs, and add Excadrill, Druddigon, Gabite, and Shelgon, but Mitja is right, this is kinda overdone. Not really sure what else to put here either.
Then there was a few other miscellaneous things I wanted to take care of for distribution and accessibility:
-Rattata for Rt. 101-104 and Rt. 116, and Raticate for Rt. 120 and Rt. 121.
-Poliwag and Poliwhirl for various fishing and a few Surfing areas.
-Magby/Elekid as version exclusives for Rt. 110, and then on Rt. 121 Magmar/Electabuzz.
-Cherubi/Cherrim for Rt. 117.
-Croagunk for Rt. 118, and then later Croagunk and Toxicroak in the Safari Zone.
-Kricketune for Rt. 119.
-Stantler and Aipom for the Safari Zone
-Finneon, Skrelp, and Clauncher for Underwater.
And then there was a couple of non-expansion related distribution changes I wanted as well:
-Move Meditite to Granite Cave and then replace it on Mt. Pyre with Medicham (I have no idea why they make us wait so late in the game for Meditite).
-Move Absol from Rt. 120 to Mt. Pyre (makes more sense).
Blob55 said:
I don't agree with that at all, there's plenty of 4th and 5th gen Pokemon that would be more fitting for Hoenn than some of the ones in Emerald. Besides, they can always just keep the 2nd gen Pokemon that appeared in Emerald post game.
I think Unown should be included, as you need to transfer twice to get one in XY.
Water:
Seel line
Vaporeon
Shellos line
Tympole line
Clauncher line
Psychic:
Espeon
Unown
Normal:
Happiny line
Audino
Grass:
Leafeon
Bug:
Pineco line
Poison:
Skrelp line
Rock:
Binacle line
Fighting:
Tyrogue line
Dark:
Umbreon
Scraggy line
Vullaby line
Electric:
Jolteon
Shinx line
Tynamo line
Fire:
Growlithe line
Ponyta line
Flareon
Darumaka line
Litwick line
Heatmor
Ghost:
Yamask line
Frillish line
Misdreavus line
Steel:
Klink line
Durant
Fairy:
Clefairy line
Cottonee line
Flabébé line
Sylveon
Carbink
Klefki
Dragon:
Druddigon
Noibat line
Ice:
Sneasel line
Swinub line
Glaceon
Bergmite line
It ends up at 302
List of Fully Evolved Pokémon type by use
Water: 29
Psychic: 20
Flying: 16
Fighting: 15
Normal: 14
Ground: 13
Grass: 12
Bug: 12
Rock: 12
Fighting: 11
Dark: 11
Fire: 11
Steel: 11
Poison: 10
Electric: 10
Fairy: 10
Dragon: 10
Ice: 10
Ghost: 9
Water:
Seel line
Vaporeon
Shellos line
Tympole line
Clauncher line
Psychic:
Espeon
Unown
Normal:
Happiny line
Audino
Grass:
Leafeon
Bug:
Pineco line
Poison:
Skrelp line
Rock:
Binacle line
Fighting:
Tyrogue line
Dark:
Umbreon
Scraggy line
Vullaby line
Electric:
Jolteon
Shinx line
Tynamo line
Fire:
Growlithe line
Ponyta line
Flareon
Darumaka line
Litwick line
Heatmor
Ghost:
Yamask line
Frillish line
Misdreavus line
Steel:
Klink line
Durant
Fairy:
Clefairy line
Cottonee line
Flabébé line
Sylveon
Carbink
Klefki
Dragon:
Druddigon
Noibat line
Ice:
Sneasel line
Swinub line
Glaceon
Bergmite line
It ends up at 302
List of Fully Evolved Pokémon type by use
Water: 29
Psychic: 20
Flying: 16
Fighting: 15
Normal: 14
Ground: 13
Grass: 12
Bug: 12
Rock: 12
Fighting: 11
Dark: 11
Fire: 11
Steel: 11
Poison: 10
Electric: 10
Fairy: 10
Dragon: 10
Ice: 10
Ghost: 9
Mitja said:
considering we just had X/Y with Sylveon being used in all the Fairy type promo crap, I'd actually welcome a break from Eevee xD
they've always felt like a safety belt to me... just something they can rely on in game that people generally like and provide decent options for several different types in one family.
Blob55 said:
In the game? Yes, it's been far too long since Unown was catchable. In the Hoenn Dex? No, there's no real reason to include them in the main game, it's hard to find a place where it could fit.
Mitja said:
Agreed, they've literally been in every other regional dex in existence, and I'd like to keep it that way. They're really overrated and they could use a rest.
His Goominess said:
Despite the fact that my favorite pokemon ever is an eeveelution, I do see what you mean about the safety net. I never thought of this before, but they do rely a bit too much on the family as strong pokemon and to introduce new mechanics (dark type, day and night, fairy type and amie). I do hope they don't introduce it in the remakes as it never seemed to fit in Hoenn. I never liked it when remakes added too many other pokemon. I also find that when eevee is introduced, I have an obligation to get an espeon which makes me miss out on other great psychic types. That said, I find it extremely unlikely that eevee will be included because it existed in gen iii, but wasn't in the game. It seems silly to introduce it now.
Blob55 said:
I don't see any new areas visible in the main games that could serve as a suitable location for Unown. The best place I can think of for Unown would be a new ruins area adjacent to Desert Underpass.
I always thought the Sealed Chamber (where you activate the Regis event) was the perfect place to put the Unown...
Anyway, I hope they include Growlithe and Houndour... because I want to include them on my teams and I'd like to avoid having to breed them...
Anyway, I hope they include Growlithe and Houndour... because I want to include them on my teams and I'd like to avoid having to breed them...
Btw, Glameow and Stunky need to be available in these games because I think that without trading and connecting, they are scarcily available.
I can see both of them in the Safari as a last resort, being a outbreak with Glameow to the East of Rustboro (nod to Skitty) and Stunky to the East of Fortree (somehow it and kecleon seem like a nice pair in that route), or lastly, being indeed placed as permanent, having Glameow between Oldale and Petalburg and Stunky to the East of Fortree or perhaps Jagged Path.
Hum...both in English and in Japanese, those ruins' name as well as it's creation is connected to Johto and Sinnoh, so I don't think we can (or it's suitable to) have some foreign building built on Hoenn just for that, but we could perhaps have some way to be transported to those same Shinto/Shinjoh ruins...and not only obtain the D/P/Pt but also Unown (I already didn't liked the Embedded Tower, that despite the ground markings, seemed more like some Sky Pillar in Johto due to the stairs with Rayquaza's pattern and that's the reason why I prefer the transportation instead of a new building).
I can see both of them in the Safari as a last resort, being a outbreak with Glameow to the East of Rustboro (nod to Skitty) and Stunky to the East of Fortree (somehow it and kecleon seem like a nice pair in that route), or lastly, being indeed placed as permanent, having Glameow between Oldale and Petalburg and Stunky to the East of Fortree or perhaps Jagged Path.
Mitja said:
Hum...both in English and in Japanese, those ruins' name as well as it's creation is connected to Johto and Sinnoh, so I don't think we can (or it's suitable to) have some foreign building built on Hoenn just for that, but we could perhaps have some way to be transported to those same Shinto/Shinjoh ruins...and not only obtain the D/P/Pt but also Unown (I already didn't liked the Embedded Tower, that despite the ground markings, seemed more like some Sky Pillar in Johto due to the stairs with Rayquaza's pattern and that's the reason why I prefer the transportation instead of a new building).
Mitja said:I added the 10 new evolutions, then reordered the hoenndex so its more grouped into areas (rather than how you personally meet the pokemon), and cut it up into those.
Looking at it like that, the more boring areas seemed to be the routes around Fortree, the safari-zone, Shoal cave, and Seafloor cavern.
I carefully added pokemon from gens I,II,IV,V to each group, trying not to overdo it, but adding at least something interesting in most of them.
This is the result:
-Poliwags in freshwater places, as surfing on those is REALLY boring (actually, it could be Tympole though to avoid too many Water Stone evolutions, but Water/Ground is overdone in comparison to Poliwrath)
-Pinecos and Cherubis I was thinking to add to petalburg woods at first, but now I've remembered the berry-tree encounters in XY, and seeing these two both imitating stuff that falls from trees, if that feature is in, those two would be cool. (Forretress adds a Bug and Steel diversity that isn't Escavalier/Scizor for a change, while Cherubi is unavailable in XY)
-Buneary above Rustburo somewhere (Hoenn lacks friendship evolutions and Buneary was one of those actually unavailable pokemon in XY).
-Drifloon (an early ghost-type is so refreshing) perhaps doing it's weekly appearance on the shore north of Rustburo somewhere
-Frillish around the Abandoned ship. Sold.
-Alomomola and Mantine to add diversity to the open sea surfing experience
-Shellos simply deserves a place in this region somewhere for almost making it into RSE, although it's ending type combo is not that exciting with Swampert/Whiscash around. It even has a land vs sea vibe in it's form difference, Im convinced that was a thought somewhere in its origin.
-Klink is really the only proper candidate to add to New Mauville (Tynamo doesn't strike me as something that would live in manmade places), probably even makes more sense than a natural cave for it like we've seen so far.
-Cottonee and Hoppip, some floaty Grass types east and west of Mauville (also a second Sun Stone user and an extra Fairy-line in this Dark dex)
-Darumaka for the Fiery path and around the volcano, brofisting with Machops ;D
-Clefairy (I was surprised they put Jigglypuff in the games that promoted the Fairy type instead of Clefairy.) and Elygems are highly appropriate for Meteor falls what with Solrock/Lunatones around the place, especially if they get any sort of expansion or secret area /wishful thinking
-improving the desert with some Sandstream (Hippopotas. which actually makes freakin sense compared to them on the cliff on the Rhyhorn path in XY.. ), gliding scorpions (Gligar) and more flora (Maractus).
-Finneon for more freshwater fishing diversity. (yet another of those few unavailable in XY)
-Yanma, Carnivine to make the paths around Fortree more exotic, perhaps some fake trees to go along with invisible chameleons.
-Larvesta for that lone cave east of Fortree.
-Misdreavus as a third ghost in the tower (it has like 5 stories IIIRC lol)
-Litwick fits Mt.Pyres theme very well, and Bronzor adds the same ritualistic feel Chimecho is there for already.
Safari:
much could be done here, but it's kind of unneeded with how diverse and colorful Hoenn already is.
-Mankey (more fighting diversity always welcome)
-Snubbull (as is Fairy)
-Stantler (Girafarig is in there so wynaut)
-Teddiursa (Phanpy is in there so wynaut)
-Nidorans for some serious 3 stage poison line action (and as a nod to Kantos safari)
-Zebstrika (it's just cool and a zebra xD)
(there'd still be room for some Hoothoots or Shuckles or Houndours (obvious Emerald bias I know) or more... like Mareeps...but we've had Mega fabulous-line in XY and BW2, so rather not)
-Shellder and Qwilfish for more spiky underwater stuff
-Tynamo and Dwebble for underwater caves (seafloor cavern)
-Seel and Sneasel for Shoal cave and Ice diversity
and that brings the number quite close to 300 already. I've had more thoughts behind thee additions than I bothered writing by the end of the list..
Last few is either some fanservice I'm hesitant to add (more pseudo legends, eeveelutions...), another starter set gaining new megas (Johto if any), or who knows what.
Pineco I can understand, but Cherubi would be more suited to Petalburg Woods.
Seel isn't even ice type, why not use Bergmite/Avalugg?
At seafloor cavern, we can raise it a bit to Eelektrik and Crustle.
Klink as the only new mauville pokemon: Joltik says hi.
Frillish around the abandoned ship: yes please.
Why not add shellos and gastrodon, seeing as they're rejected Gen 3 Pokemon that made it into gen 4?
Snubull and Mankey: we have enough Fighting types, but more Fairies are always welcome.
No Qwilfish. PLEASE. we have enough Water/Poison types around here already.
As for Mantine, did you consider adding the Remoraid line? Mantyke needs a Remoraid to evolve.
What about Growlithe, Houndour and Magmar( to expand team Magma's HORRIBLE pokemon choices)?
woohoo962 said:Mitja said:I added the 10 new evolutions, then reordered the hoenndex so its more grouped into areas (rather than how you personally meet the pokemon), and cut it up into those.
Looking at it like that, the more boring areas seemed to be the routes around Fortree, the safari-zone, Shoal cave, and Seafloor cavern.
I carefully added pokemon from gens I,II,IV,V to each group, trying not to overdo it, but adding at least something interesting in most of them.
This is the result:
-Poliwags in freshwater places, as surfing on those is REALLY boring (actually, it could be Tympole though to avoid too many Water Stone evolutions, but Water/Ground is overdone in comparison to Poliwrath)
-Pinecos and Cherubis I was thinking to add to petalburg woods at first, but now I've remembered the berry-tree encounters in XY, and seeing these two both imitating stuff that falls from trees, if that feature is in, those two would be cool. (Forretress adds a Bug and Steel diversity that isn't Escavalier/Scizor for a change, while Cherubi is unavailable in XY)
-Buneary above Rustburo somewhere (Hoenn lacks friendship evolutions and Buneary was one of those actually unavailable pokemon in XY).
-Drifloon (an early ghost-type is so refreshing) perhaps doing it's weekly appearance on the shore north of Rustburo somewhere
-Frillish around the Abandoned ship. Sold.
-Alomomola and Mantine to add diversity to the open sea surfing experience
-Shellos simply deserves a place in this region somewhere for almost making it into RSE, although it's ending type combo is not that exciting with Swampert/Whiscash around. It even has a land vs sea vibe in it's form difference, Im convinced that was a thought somewhere in its origin.
-Klink is really the only proper candidate to add to New Mauville (Tynamo doesn't strike me as something that would live in manmade places), probably even makes more sense than a natural cave for it like we've seen so far.
-Cottonee and Hoppip, some floaty Grass types east and west of Mauville (also a second Sun Stone user and an extra Fairy-line in this Dark dex)
-Darumaka for the Fiery path and around the volcano, brofisting with Machops ;D
-Clefairy (I was surprised they put Jigglypuff in the games that promoted the Fairy type instead of Clefairy.) and Elygems are highly appropriate for Meteor falls what with Solrock/Lunatones around the place, especially if they get any sort of expansion or secret area /wishful thinking
-improving the desert with some Sandstream (Hippopotas. which actually makes freakin sense compared to them on the cliff on the Rhyhorn path in XY.. ), gliding scorpions (Gligar) and more flora (Maractus).
-Finneon for more freshwater fishing diversity. (yet another of those few unavailable in XY)
-Yanma, Carnivine to make the paths around Fortree more exotic, perhaps some fake trees to go along with invisible chameleons.
-Larvesta for that lone cave east of Fortree.
-Misdreavus as a third ghost in the tower (it has like 5 stories IIIRC lol)
-Litwick fits Mt.Pyres theme very well, and Bronzor adds the same ritualistic feel Chimecho is there for already.
Safari:
much could be done here, but it's kind of unneeded with how diverse and colorful Hoenn already is.
-Mankey (more fighting diversity always welcome)
-Snubbull (as is Fairy)
-Stantler (Girafarig is in there so wynaut)
-Teddiursa (Phanpy is in there so wynaut)
-Nidorans for some serious 3 stage poison line action (and as a nod to Kantos safari)
-Zebstrika (it's just cool and a zebra xD)
(there'd still be room for some Hoothoots or Shuckles or Houndours (obvious Emerald bias I know) or more... like Mareeps...but we've had Mega fabulous-line in XY and BW2, so rather not)
-Shellder and Qwilfish for more spiky underwater stuff
-Tynamo and Dwebble for underwater caves (seafloor cavern)
-Seel and Sneasel for Shoal cave and Ice diversity
and that brings the number quite close to 300 already. I've had more thoughts behind thee additions than I bothered writing by the end of the list..
Last few is either some fanservice I'm hesitant to add (more pseudo legends, eeveelutions...), another starter set gaining new megas (Johto if any), or who knows what.
Pineco I can understand, but Cherubi would be more suited to Petalburg Woods.
Seel isn't even ice type, why not use Bergmite/Avalugg?
At seafloor cavern, we can raise it a bit to Eelektrik and Crustle.
Klink as the only new mauville pokemon: Joltik says hi.
Frillish around the abandoned ship: yes please.
Why not add shellos and gastrodon, seeing as they're rejected Gen 3 Pokemon that made it into gen 4?
Snubull and Mankey: we have enough Fighting types, but more Fairies are always welcome.
No Qwilfish. PLEASE. we have enough Water/Poison types around here already.
As for Mantine, did you consider adding the Remoraid line? Mantyke needs a Remoraid to evolve.
What about Growlithe, Houndour and Magmar( to expand team Magma's HORRIBLE pokemon choices)?
I made a list too. It adds a lot more variety to types.
Water:
Seel line
Vaporeon
Piplup Line
Shellos line
Tympole line
Clauncher line
Psychic:
Espeon
Unown
Normal:
Happiny line
Audino
Grass:
Turtwig line
Leafeon
Bug:
Pineco line
Poison:
Skrelp line
Rock:
Binacle line
Fighting:
Tyrogue line
Dark:
Umbreon
Scraggy line
Vullaby line
Electric:
Jolteon
Shinx line
Tynamo line
Fire:
Growlithe line
Ponyta line
Flareon
Chimchar line
Darumaka line
Litwick line
Heatmor
Ghost:
Yamask line
Frillish line
Misdreavus line
Steel:
Klink line
Durant
Fairy:
Clefairy line
Cottonee line
Flabébé line
Sylveon
Carbink
Klefki
Dragon:
Druddigon
Noibat line
Ice:
Sneasel line
Swinub line
Glaceon
Bergmite line
It ends up at 301
List of Fully Evolved Pokémon type by use
Water: 30
Psychic: 20
Flying: 16
Normal: 14
Ground: 14
Grass: 13
Fire: 12
Bug: 12
Rock: 12
Steel: 12
Fighting: 11
Dark: 11
Poison: 10
Electric: 10
Fairy: 10
Dragon: 10
Ice: 10
Ghost: 9