Free-will vs Destiny
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Juliacoolo
Your destiny is just a result of your free will. In result, you control your own destiny, which completely voids the whole idea of a destiny. God knows what will your happen in your life, so I guess you could call that destiny, but the thing is that your future is not dictated by an outside force. (Well there is always holding people against their will, but that's the other person's free will :B)
Free Will.
*Edit* Sorry PMJ ._.
Free Will.
*Edit* Sorry PMJ ._.
I believe free will because every person has the ability to do what they want. Each decision that is made will affect something else. Each action has a consequence whether good or bad.
I would just lock this now, as destiny is a result of free-will which is slightly obvious but it still has discussion value however religion affects people's opinion on this kind of thing way too much not for a flame war not to happen.
PMJ said:
i will try my hardest to be "that guy".
We are all destined to die....so both, you can chose the actions up to your death.
It looks like someone saw the LOST premier tonight, Lol. I'm guessing that's where the idea for this topic came from?
Non-Religious Answer:
There is no Destiny. We make our own choices in life and that's all there is to it.
Religious Answer:
There is no Destiny. God knows -all- BUT only because he knows us so well. That doesn't necessarily mean he makes us do what he wants. He gave us free-will, that was a gift.
So why are people afraid this will turn into a religious debate? Religious people and Non-religious people are on the same page when it comes to this...There is no destiny only free will..
Non-Religious Answer:
There is no Destiny. We make our own choices in life and that's all there is to it.
Religious Answer:
There is no Destiny. God knows -all- BUT only because he knows us so well. That doesn't necessarily mean he makes us do what he wants. He gave us free-will, that was a gift.
So why are people afraid this will turn into a religious debate? Religious people and Non-religious people are on the same page when it comes to this...There is no destiny only free will..
Here's another loopy way to look at this; your destiny is always preset, because your destiny will only be confirmed once you're gone. If anyone ever tells your destiny, inherently it will be incorrect because your free will will affect your choices that may or may not lead up to that result.
The other thing is that destiny is really only a tangible concept in precogniscence and time travel, neither of which are particularly widespread.
The other thing is that destiny is really only a tangible concept in precogniscence and time travel, neither of which are particularly widespread.
I don't see much valuable discussion is this since your destiny is destined by your own choices. Own choices which you make as a result of free will.
And I don't see any reason why our future would be destined. And since the question was free will or destiny I've to go for free will to give you a satisfying answer. However like many people already said before, your destiny is just a result of free will, your own choices.
And I don't see any reason why our future would be destined. And since the question was free will or destiny I've to go for free will to give you a satisfying answer. However like many people already said before, your destiny is just a result of free will, your own choices.
What makes a religious debate so much worse than, say, a political debate? I'd figure the 1st would be more important, since this is how you live your life we're talking about, I'd think you should at least be able to defend it properly. Just because I get offended when someone mentions poetry doesn't mean it shouldn't be mentioned, it means I should man up.PMJ said:
But I digress. There is one funny theory in psychology which states that your consciousness is just justifying the actions of your subconsciousness, giving you the illusion of free will. This does seem to be true to some extent, but in no way means the future is set.
Either way, the brain is programmed in some way to do specific actions in specific situation, to what extent we have actual conscious control over these actions remains to be debated. Thought does seem to enable us to make actions based on conclusion we consciously reached, so I think that's where our free will lies.
Free will is a vague concept, though, because to what extent are your actions your actions and not guided by something else? Unless you turn to theology, it's pretty hard to find a good definition.
You make your own destiny. We have total free will. You can't change what you've done, only what you're going to do. I know in my head I can choose to do one thing or another. Since I am physically choosing myself what to do in my life, how can i be destined to do certain things? If I found out what I was meant to do to fulfil my destiny, I could choose to skit round it. Therefore destiny is a lie D:
/totaly isn't meant to be here any more lol, I'll stick around till the end of the week to say final goodbyes before minimal posting
/totaly isn't meant to be here any more lol, I'll stick around till the end of the week to say final goodbyes before minimal posting
Why not both?
If one has a destiny, it doesn't mean that he has no free will, because the ability to make his own decisions can lead to the destined outcome. For example, perhaps some higher power has set my destiny to win the London marathon- I practice for the event because I want to (i.e. free will) and eventually I do indeed win it. Another destiny is death, a fate that none can escape, but we can still have free will in the meantime.
I agree with Spoon, free will is a very fuzzy idea. Here's a quote from the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy:
“Free Will is a philosophical term of art for a particular sort of capacity of rational agents to choose a course of action from among various alternatives."
This is a pretty acceptable definition, but many people make the mistake that free will is something that you either do or do not have, with no room in between. Clearly, there are different values of free will- a woman living in America will probably have more choices available to her than a woman living in Afghanistan, for example.
If one has a destiny, it doesn't mean that he has no free will, because the ability to make his own decisions can lead to the destined outcome. For example, perhaps some higher power has set my destiny to win the London marathon- I practice for the event because I want to (i.e. free will) and eventually I do indeed win it. Another destiny is death, a fate that none can escape, but we can still have free will in the meantime.
I agree with Spoon, free will is a very fuzzy idea. Here's a quote from the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy:
“Free Will is a philosophical term of art for a particular sort of capacity of rational agents to choose a course of action from among various alternatives."
This is a pretty acceptable definition, but many people make the mistake that free will is something that you either do or do not have, with no room in between. Clearly, there are different values of free will- a woman living in America will probably have more choices available to her than a woman living in Afghanistan, for example.
bacon said:
I don't agree that there are different levels of free will. You either have it or you don't. In your example a woman living in Afghanistan has the same amount of free will as the woman living in America. The woman in Afghanistan has fewer OPTIONS but the same amount of free will. Both women can make whatever decisions they want but those decisions they make will lead them to different end points (most likely).
The definition of free will is vague nevertheless. Say someone promises you eternal salvation if you worship him, and will make you burn forever if you don't. Is this still free will? Technically, you can choose not to, but the rules of the game are made so it's realistically not an option.SixNumbers said:
Another example; you have been indoctrinated as a child to believe that committing terrorist attacks (hooray for extreme examples!) is the cool thing to do. You've been trained in the art of pushing a button, and you've been taught that this one act of terrorism is your ultimate goal in life. When you are about to do it, you technically still have a choice, or do you? And is this your choice?
The examples are endless!
Heavenly Spoon :F said:
In this case, free will kicks in before you start following. So to continue that example, if "somebody someone promises you eternal salvation if you worship him, and will make you burn forever if you don't," then I have the choice NOT to believe him. Why do I automatically have to believe him and believe what he's telling me is true, that I will burn forever if I don't?
Heavenly Spoon :F said:
This is unfortunate but yes there is still a choice to do it or not to do it. If you go along with it "That's your choice to do it" ...I know what you're saying, the kids are practically "brainwashed" but still when they grow up they still get to make the choice of whether that's the path for them or not. Most likely they will choose to go along with it because that's how they were raised and that's unfortunate but ultimately it's still their choice that they made based on the information they were presented.
Well, at that very second before pushing the almighty button you technically still have a million options to choose from. Although alot of these options are very unlikely. Like suddenly realizing it was wrong to eat your whole life meat and becoming a vegetarian, greeting an old man, buying a tomato from your neighbour or just simply don't push the button. So there is some free will, although the chance he indeed pushes the button would be around 99%.Heavenly Spoon :F said: