Ho-oh EX Variants
- Thread starter Blah
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r3skyline said:
Worse case, with Darkrai, Keldeo gives everything free retreat. Isn't Kyurem's retreat like four?
And It just doesn't seem worth it unless you're, well, Hammertime. Everything's too important in my list to make room for hammers anyway.
In an effort to generate meaningful discussion, what are some other interesting techs besides the aforementioned Keldeo and hammers (there are many) that you all have thought of/tried? I'm currently playing around with one Registeel in my list because someone said they had had success with it, but so far, it hasn't been pulling its weight.
Ah. Techs...
Ive tried many different combos of the following..
Registeel Ex
Meloetta
Tornadus Ex
Sigilyph
Virizon EPO/NVI
Terrakion
Kyurem Ex
Kyurem
Keldeo Ex
Keldeo 47
Dusknoir (actually....works quite well when the deck takes a different approach)
Rayquaza
Shaymin ex
Celebi Ex (actually worked quite well due to its switching ability)
Kyogre Ex
Crushing Hammer
Enhanced Hammer
Hooligan
Hugh
Tropical Beach
Max potion
Potion
Poke Comm
Revive
SSU
Rescue Scarf
Cheren
Gone through a bit. Some of those techs i still use, and some are being used in my current version. Registeel was an old tech that was used in the early days of hooh ex builds. It was useful in that format but not anymore.
Ive tried many different combos of the following..
Registeel Ex
Meloetta
Tornadus Ex
Sigilyph
Virizon EPO/NVI
Terrakion
Kyurem Ex
Kyurem
Keldeo Ex
Keldeo 47
Dusknoir (actually....works quite well when the deck takes a different approach)
Rayquaza
Shaymin ex
Celebi Ex (actually worked quite well due to its switching ability)
Kyogre Ex
Crushing Hammer
Enhanced Hammer
Hooligan
Hugh
Tropical Beach
Max potion
Potion
Poke Comm
Revive
SSU
Rescue Scarf
Cheren
Gone through a bit. Some of those techs i still use, and some are being used in my current version. Registeel was an old tech that was used in the early days of hooh ex builds. It was useful in that format but not anymore.
r3skyline said:Ah. Techs...
Ive tried many different combos of the following..
Registeel Ex
Meloetta
Tornadus Ex
Sigilyph
Virizon EPO/NVI
Terrakion
Kyurem Ex
Kyurem
Keldeo Ex
Keldeo 47
Dusknoir (actually....works quite well when the deck takes a different approach)
Rayquaza
Shaymin ex
Celebi Ex (actually worked quite well due to its switching ability)
Kyogre Ex
Crushing Hammer
Enhanced Hammer
Hooligan
Hugh
Tropical Beach
Max potion
Potion
Poke Comm
Revive
SSU
Rescue Scarf
Cheren
Gone through a bit. Some of those techs i still use, and some are being used in my current version. Registeel was an old tech that was used in the early days of hooh ex builds. It was useful in that format but not anymore.
Well, after so many techs, what worked?
I have fallen in love with this deck after playing it for one tournament. Its versatility has left me spellbound and I think it has the potential to (with the correct list and play) win any tournament.
Ah, what worked. Thats something i have to keep to myself at the moment. I gave a skeleton of what people should start from and stick to. Trust me, that skeleton will work even by itself.
What i will tell tho, is that i kept so far, 1x sigilyph, and 1x terrakion. I felt that 2 terrakion just cluttered, and having a min of 1 siggy let me alter around other things.
As for T/S/S, rescue scarf seems to put pressure on people. kinda funny sometimes. tropical beach was amazing both beginning and late game when people try N shenanigans. Max potion was incredible as landorus/darkrai gave me issues with their sniping nonsense. i wish and wish and wish i could fit x4 crushing hammer/x2 enhanced. those cards are so gooood right now.
What i will tell tho, is that i kept so far, 1x sigilyph, and 1x terrakion. I felt that 2 terrakion just cluttered, and having a min of 1 siggy let me alter around other things.
As for T/S/S, rescue scarf seems to put pressure on people. kinda funny sometimes. tropical beach was amazing both beginning and late game when people try N shenanigans. Max potion was incredible as landorus/darkrai gave me issues with their sniping nonsense. i wish and wish and wish i could fit x4 crushing hammer/x2 enhanced. those cards are so gooood right now.
r3skyline said:Ah, what worked. Thats something i have to keep to myself at the moment. I gave a skeleton of what people should start from and stick to. Trust me, that skeleton will work even by itself.
What i will tell tho, is that i kept so far, 1x sigilyph, and 1x terrakion. I felt that 2 terrakion just cluttered, and having a min of 1 siggy let me alter around other things.
As for T/S/S, rescue scarf seems to put pressure on people. kinda funny sometimes. tropical beach was amazing both beginning and late game when people try N shenanigans. Max potion was incredible as landorus/darkrai gave me issues with their sniping nonsense. i wish and wish and wish i could fit x4 crushing hammer/x2 enhanced. those cards are so gooood right now.
Max Potion and Tropical Beach...
Sounds cool but VERY risky.
Ya know, now that I think about it, Max Potion would be really good. Last gme I played, I looked at my Bench, and everything had damage, but nothing had energy (due to retreating). One time, my opponent used X-Ball on my Mewtwo for 140 (Plus Power), and it was I KO range of an unboosted Retaliate. Fortunately, her last Catcher was prized. I did Computer Search for a Super Scoop Up, which failed, but if it had been a Max Potion, I wouldn't have had to worry. I'm taking out the Super Scool Ups anyway because I'm already too unlucky with coin flips to justify playing this deck, and I was thinking what the last card to put in should be. I might actually try that.
I had also considered Hugh, but you have to have eight cards in your hand for it to be worth it, and even then, Ultra Ball discards the same amount of cards plus, you get a Pokemon and still get to use your Supporter for draw.
I also don't recomend a Stage 2 in a big Basic deck
I had also considered Hugh, but you have to have eight cards in your hand for it to be worth it, and even then, Ultra Ball discards the same amount of cards plus, you get a Pokemon and still get to use your Supporter for draw.
I also don't recomend a Stage 2 in a big Basic deck
The future for Ho-Oh EX Decks has me rather worried, even disheartened...
When Plasma Energy, Colress Machine, and Ether are released, will that render Ho-Oh EX obsolete? I don't know for sure...
When Plasma Energy, Colress Machine, and Ether are released, will that render Ho-Oh EX obsolete? I don't know for sure...
I dont like Landos in Ho Oh. If you dont have fightning energy 1st turn then its dead weight. You can easily say that for other cards like Silgiyph and Terrakion, but I feel those cards all have to be build up on energy to get any of their attacks off while Lando your mainly using it for that 1st attack (and sometimes the 2nd one).
I tried Tornadus EX, Regigigas, Virizion NVI and Zapdos as techs and didnt like any of them. I feel for tornadus to work your deck has to be more centered around it. I was playing 1 Skyarrow Bridge and a Tornadus and it was not that great. I ended up sticking with Shayman EX, its been winning a lot of games for me especially against anyone playing Keledo.
I dont think this deck is Tier 2 even based on results since its just another Mewtwo variant and most Mewtwo variants are top tier. Every meta deck can run into bad luck and a 1st turn Ho Oh isnt always end of the world. The coin flipping doesnt matter that much especially when you have multiple Ho Oh in the discard. Your odds start to increase of bringing it back. I feel when you start playing Super Scoop Ups in the deck, then theres a lot of luck on the line but usually its a very consistent deck that can handle almost every deck in the meta. I cant say that about a lot of other decks. Almost all other meta decks have weaknesses but in Ho Oh the only real weakness is sometimes how you draw at best.
I tried Tornadus EX, Regigigas, Virizion NVI and Zapdos as techs and didnt like any of them. I feel for tornadus to work your deck has to be more centered around it. I was playing 1 Skyarrow Bridge and a Tornadus and it was not that great. I ended up sticking with Shayman EX, its been winning a lot of games for me especially against anyone playing Keledo.
I dont think this deck is Tier 2 even based on results since its just another Mewtwo variant and most Mewtwo variants are top tier. Every meta deck can run into bad luck and a 1st turn Ho Oh isnt always end of the world. The coin flipping doesnt matter that much especially when you have multiple Ho Oh in the discard. Your odds start to increase of bringing it back. I feel when you start playing Super Scoop Ups in the deck, then theres a lot of luck on the line but usually its a very consistent deck that can handle almost every deck in the meta. I cant say that about a lot of other decks. Almost all other meta decks have weaknesses but in Ho Oh the only real weakness is sometimes how you draw at best.
I am currently "re"-trying out Tornadus EX in Ho-Oh. I have 2 Tornadus EX, and 1 Skyarrow, and I find it really improves the Keldeo matchup. T1 Blow Through for 60 isn't all too common, but it's nice just to have something that's not Mewtwo to swing 100 on Keldeo every turn. And it's not teching something too specific for a matchup like Virizion because, of course, outside of the matchup, it's a way to get energy into the discard. Most games, I'd have an active Tornadus using Power Blast, and an army of Mewtwos benched waiting for my opponent to lay down his. When the Tornaduses (Tornadi, whatever the plural is) were gone, I could usually sweep with Mewtwo.
Mora, are you liking the Tornadus EX? I am currently liking Zekrom in mine version. And a late Shaymin EX is nearly unbeatable (or at least good for few prizes).
There will be a hooh variant of poison + virbank for sure. To utilize this, we will have to play min of 2x tornadus now. :/ lame. But whatever, its good for the deck anyway.
SO, i will be moving on to the tornadus variant without landorus, or possibly just run landy/tornadus/mewtwo
SO, i will be moving on to the tornadus variant without landorus, or possibly just run landy/tornadus/mewtwo
MMAmonchan said:
Yeah, I like it. I suppose most lists will already have something like Bouffalant to hit Keldeo hard. I don't think I'll be able to respond to Sigilyph as quickly because I had to take out Tornadus EP. I still have Terrakion and Rayquaza (not sure if the Rayquaza will stay). I'm not sure how consistent my energy line will be either without Tornadus; I haven't had time to test my new list against Darkrai variants yet, so I could run into problems getting the right energh on Terrakion since I have almost every type of energy.
I have never understood the reasoning for tech'ing in a Shaymin for the Keldeo match-up...
Shaymin EX only has 110 HP, which means a Keldeo EX with 3 Water energies (and this is what it needs to pull if its attack at a minimum basis) can OHKO it, so how does it help you in anyway???
Shaymin EX only has 110 HP, which means a Keldeo EX with 3 Water energies (and this is what it needs to pull if its attack at a minimum basis) can OHKO it, so how does it help you in anyway???
I think that the point behind Shaymin is to use it in combination with N in the hopes that your opponent doesn't topdeck an answer to it.
Even if it doesn't work like that, the prize trade is still even, and if they stacked up a lot of energies on a Keldeo, you send that straight to the discard. I think I would like Virizion better if I were hard countering Keldeo just cause it doesn't give up two prizes (Plus, I believe it takes an extra energy to revenge it.), but Shaymin out of nowhere is easier to pull off than Virizion. And Shaymin is better in general so that it's not dead weight outside of the Keldeo matchup.
Hey!
MMAmonchan said:
Even if it doesn't work like that, the prize trade is still even, and if they stacked up a lot of energies on a Keldeo, you send that straight to the discard. I think I would like Virizion better if I were hard countering Keldeo just cause it doesn't give up two prizes (Plus, I believe it takes an extra energy to revenge it.), but Shaymin out of nowhere is easier to pull off than Virizion. And Shaymin is better in general so that it's not dead weight outside of the Keldeo matchup.
MrGatr said:
Hey!