BW/BW2 Light-Type, Why or Why Not?

[Sevus]

I think duel masters uses light type. Probably magic (not sure)

Magic: The Gathering doesn't use traditional elements. White somewhat corresponds to Light, but it means more "order" than "good." Duel Masters did have a Light type as well, but that game was fairly forgettable.

However, in just about every game that uses elemental rock-paper-scissors, there is a Light/Holy to oppose Dark/Evil. Why not Pokémon? It could easily fit in, and is an obvious addition. Again, it doesn't have to represent natural light, and taking inspiration from other sources is something every game does.

I will reiterate Fighting =/= honor. Fighting techniques require discipline, yes, but they are simply techniques designed to overwhelm the opponent with sheer power, generally while entailing severe risk to the user. Close Combat is one of the strongest moves in the game, but leaves the user vulnerable to a counter-attack. Cross Chop has a high power and critical-hit ratio, but low accuracy. Submission inflicts recoil damage. Vital Throw, while it will never miss, forces you to move last. Focus Punch does the same, but fails if you get hit. Superpower exhausts the user. Even the abilities commonly associated with Fighters fall along the discipline or high-risk/high-reward type. Technician and Inner Focus would require significant training to master. Guts requires the Pokémon to suffer to activate. No Guard ensures the Pokémon will always hit, but it will always be hit in turn.

Of all the Fighting-Type Pokémon I can think of, only Gallade was implied to be honorable, and he was modeled after a samurai. If people want to bring up counterexamples, please do so, but I'm still not seeing the connection.

 

[Pokequaza]

I meant that people in the future would get bored.
I'm not completely bored by the current types, but I would like the addition of a new one.

Don't make assumptions like that, how would you know?

 

[swimfastray]

Pokemon will last for a very long time.
People will become bored of the old types.
The choices are to let some Pokemon have three types, or add a new type every so often.

I promise, as long as there are new creatures and new type combinations people will never get bored with Pokemon. Pokemon is already EPIC, and doesn't need to change in order to keep us consumers happy. Heck, I'm still happy playing Diamond and Pearl and that came out three years ago.

I would probably be okay with Light type being introduced, but right now it just doesn't seem likely and doesn't make much sense to me. It will depend how the game integrates the new type and what kind of pokemon are Light type. They would have to explain the "discovery" of the type in the storyline for it to make sense.

Sorry to be rude, but letting pokemon have three types is just plain ridiculous. Please get some sense in your head!

You're right though. Arceus should not be Light type. But it shouldn't be normal type either. It truly should be ??? type like the move Curse because who in the Pokemon World really knows anything about Arceus?

Thanks Pokequaza, Sevus, Monpyro97 and Safariblade for backing me up!

 

[rockinpikachu]

Don't make assumptions like that, how would you know?

so your just going to keep saying u want the regulaur types and not have a twist at some point

 

[Fire_Master]

I would like to point out that just because someone doesn't want a new type, let alone light type, doesn't mean that they are against the speculation of it. Heck, if GF could find a good way to introduce a new type, I'd go nuts over it like I usually do with all things pokemon. But the types thought of so far just seem stupid to me.

Light Type: I can sort of see it happening, but not this generation. Plus, although learning the new effectiveness chart would be a nice twist and fun, I would then always be slightly dissapointed in past games for not having this type. Like something was missing that I never knew was, you know? Anyways, the way the light type is being speculated is what's making me not like the idea. But when I think of it myself, it seems alright and pretty cool.

Space/Cosmic Type: I can't really see this happening because we already have pokemon like clefairy and such who have that mysterious backstory with the moonstones and such. I don't really think pokemon will delve too much into space itself, and adding space/cosmic type pokemon would mean either having at some point to travel in space or some other other-worldly encounter, which I feel would make the game less of what it should be. Plus, the strongest space-exploration vibes that I ever got from GF was their space station in the Hoenn region, and even that didn't have much to it.

Sound Type: A sound type? I don't see why anyone would want this. Again, I am fine with speculating about it, but just imagine the movepool of a sound type pokemon. *shudders* (screech was super effective! : o)

Those are the types that I have heard speculated the most about, with light in the lead.

And a clarification: there are no "evil" pokemon. Dark type by definition is "dirty fighting", and by calling them evil, you are violating one of the primary rules of pokemon which is that no pokemon is naturally evil. Ever.

And fighting type by definition is the opposite of the dark type "dirty fighting", so "fair fighting". As I said before, light type is a nice idea, but it is hard to envision it.

And remember, pro-Lights, this isn't just a thread where you guys can flame every person who walks in and says no to Light type.

 

[Pokequaza]

so your just going to keep saying u want the regulaur types and not have a twist at some point

I didn't said that. I said I, and the majority, aren't bored yet of the existing types. And I have no idea how I will think about it in the future (although I doubt that I chance my mind). Neither do you know what you'll think in the future nor what anyone else would think.

 

[Raequaza]

I promise, as long as there are new creatures and new type combinations people will never get bored with Pokemon. Pokemon is already EPIC, and doesn't need to change in order to keep us consumers happy. Heck, I'm still happy playing Diamond and Pearl and that came out three years ago.

I would probably be okay with Light type being introduced, but right now it just doesn't seem likely and doesn't make much sense to me. It will depend how the game integrates the new type and what kind of pokemon are Light type. They would have to explain the "discovery" of the type in the storyline for it to make sense.

Sorry to be rude, but letting pokemon have three types is just plain ridiculous. Please get some sense in your head!

You're right though. Arceus should not be Light type. But it shouldn't be normal type either. It truly should be ??? type like the move Curse because who in the Pokemon World really knows anything about Arceus?

Thanks Pokequaza, Sevus, Monpyro97 and Safariblade for backing me up!

I agree that it is already epic.
In the future, people will be tired of the current types, and ask for a new type. Especially when it is needed.

And if I remember correctly, the metal and Dark types never had a discovery story.

 

[Pokémaniac]

Types should be added as necessary. The need to classify Pokemon into types makes them become more standardized, which limits creativity, but also more unified, which gives consistency. Steel was a necessary addition - I mean if you don't count a Steel type as Steel type, you'd have to put them as Rock types- which in turn would cause them to be designed differently. Like-wise, Dark-types could be Normal instead - but they'd lose their striking black colours and gain mellow browns.

Examples of types that DON'T add this are Ground and Rock - they're virtually the same type, with slightly different weaknesses/resistances! Water and Ice also are very much like this, but only from a design stance- they are still necessary, since the Weaknesses and Resistances of Water and Ice conflict.

Now, a new type can also fill in a balancing problem, like Dark and Psychic did. But is there any point in the current metagame? Not really. Steel is very good at being defensive, and Dragon is an impressive attacking type, but it's not like every team needs a Dragon or Steel type. Besides, a large part of this is that most Dragon-types are pseudo-Legendaries, and really benefit more from stats then typing. If Dragon and Steel were really big problems, wouldn’t we have more Fire and Ice types floating around?

Another point that ties in with the above is that you must consider whether adding a new type will solve the problem. If the new types won’t actually solve the problem, what’s the point? I mean, would you add a Steel type to fix a problem with Fire types? A Grass type to fix a problem with Psychic types? If an idea would conflict with logic(first example) or just have no real logical grounding(second example), then perhaps rather than working out if you need to add a type, you need to work out which type to consider.

So, I suppose, we should run through these ideas with the Light type. Would it differentiate designs? Probably, less plain Normal types and more angelic Pokemon. Would it balance the gameplay? Not particularly, unless they justified it resisting Dragon and/or being super effective against Steel-types. So, would it be a good addition? Maybe. If they have some good ideas that would make more sense as Light then Normal, then I think it would be a great addition.

P.S. I think one invalid point in this argument is "The old types are boring, we need new ones". Types are an important feature in Pokemon - they are accountable for the depth of gameplay - but adding MORE doesn't make the game more interesting. The Darkness and Steel types added lots to Pokemon, but not because they are(well, were) new - it's because they had a purpose. If the types somehow act differently to different types(Like increasing Attack and decreasing Special Attack(Just an example!) or making their attacks more accurate etc. etc.) then this argument becomes valid, but that really is beyond the scope of this argument.

Also, anyone that says “it would be too confusing/complicated” needs to learn about the harsh and unforgiving process that is game making. You can say that Nintendo are uncreative and unenthused and don’t care any more and such, but if they want to add something, no matter how minor, they will do it. By the end of the process of making a game(and anyone here that uses any sort of maker need not compare their experiences with Nintendo’s, because they have SO much work to do) spending an extra ten hours of some chump’s time making the engine capable of handling a new type is really nothing to them. You have to understand, each time they go to a new game(except when they keep most things the same, like comparing HGSS to DPP(which still had a hefty amount of engine changes!)) they pretty much have to work from the ground up – you know that video of the guy walking around that city in BW? That wasn’t possible in DPPHGSS! You know that new battle system with the extra 3D bits and stuff? That’s no mod! If they think of an appropriate feature during the creation of the design document, they’ll add it in. Obviously there is a limit to this, but in the world of adding new features, adding an extra possibility in a list, then assigning its attributes in a way that’s already been tested and used for other things in no way compares to, say, adding the Pokethlon, and the actual time needed to change the types of those old Pokemon is nothing like classifying every attack as Physical, Special or Other.

And that completes my inconclusive rant on typing!

 

[swimfastray]

I would like to point out that just because someone doesn't want a new type, let alone light type, doesn't mean that they are against the speculation of it. . . And remember, pro-Lights, this isn't just a thread where you guys can flame every person who walks in and says no to Light type.

Haha yeah definitely. I don't want make anyone angry at me, I just want to speak my mind and all. As I said, I wouldn't be disappointed or anything about a new Light type, but it just doesn't make sense to do it in the first place.

IF ZEKROM IS ELECTRIC (which I am faithful it is) RESHIRAM IS NOT LIGHT!

---

Reading what Pokemaniac said, I came to realize how useless the Dragon type is. Every Dragon type Pokemon I can think of would be perfectly suited as any other type, and many Dragon-looking Pokemon are not Dragon type at all. For instance, Flygon could easily be Ground/Flying (although it would probably be better off as Bug/Flying), Salamence could be Fire/Flying, Dragonite could be Normal/Flying or Water/Flying. Charizard looks like a Dragon type, but since it is a starter pokemon it would make it insusceptible to Blastoise, giving it an unfair advantage. Gyarados should be Dragon, but for some idiotic reason it's Flying type. There are not many Dragon-type attacks anyway and the Dragon-type attacks that there are could pass for Fire or other types. And why would a whole type be based on what kind of animal the Pokemon is? Would it make sense to have a Mammal-type or a Fish-Type? Don't get me wrong, I LOVE DRAGON TYPES!!! Dragonite is my team leader. However, in retrospect Dragon-type is kind of ridiculous.

That was off-topic. Sorry.

 

[safariblade]

tell you the truth pokemon types are wierd. for example there is:
fire
water
ice
grass
ground
electric
and that is cool and all. they are like elements. then there are random bug, flying (not wind?), posion, fighting types that dont fit. (they work, just dont fit)
so even if they DO add a light type, it might work, but in my opinion, its too late to add types.
Im hoping the legends are dragon/electric and either drag/fly, drag/fire, or drag/psy

ps: I hate when they use dragon types on legends. DRAGONS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE RARE AND HARD TO GET AND LEGENDS ARENT!

 

[Carrottime]

If you'd ask me, we don't need any new types. We have the ??? Type if we want something new.

If we're gonna fix the typing, make Poison super effective against water. Then everyone is happy forever.

 

[swimfastray]

We have the ??? Type if we want something new.

If we're gonna fix the typing, make Poison super effective against water. Then everyone is happy forever.

Arceus def should have been ???-type. Why would Poison be supereffective on water? I think water should be supereffective against Poison because of water's "healing" and "cleansing" nature, y'know?

 

[Pokémaniac]

Arceus def should have been ???-type. Why would Poison be supereffective on water? I think water should be supereffective against Poison because of water's "healing" and "cleansing" nature, y'know?

Well, Water dilutes Poison, while Poison poisons(duh) Water. SO, Supereffective against each other maybe?

I for one think Water should be Weakness to Flying, since I always think of a bird swooping down and eating a fish out of the water. But that's off topic.

 

[PMJ]

Yes it is.

 

[bacon]

I wouldn't mind a Light type, although I would actually support the removal of a few types to streamline things (Rock and Ground being combined into one is a good idea (Earth?), as is Grass and Poison. Dragon always struck me as kinda dumb...).

 

[TheRedShadow]

It makes me laugh honestly when people say we don't need new types, when its clearly obvious that we do. Look at the amount of Pokemon that are in OU+Uber compared to the amount of Pokemon that are in UU and under. And I'm not talking about type being what makes UU, UU. I'm saying that in UU, typing is what restricts powerful pokemon like Aggron, Rhyperior, and Magmortar. So with a broad horizon of typings, those powerful pokemon may rise back into power on the meta-game circuit.

And a great point was brought up that I have contemplated for months prior to reading this in the thread. Poison types. Poison is undoubtedly, one of the worst typings in the game next to Normal. Many popular types resist it, and it is ONLY supereffective against the uncommon Grass type. I agree, they should change Poison to being Supereffective against Water. It makes sense, and seeing how the games are geared towards kids, it may teach them a little more about Pollution.

I feel that the Light Type should be nuclear, revolved around healing and special defense like a different version of Steel. In this sense, I feel it should have an immunity to Dark, seeing how its Light illuminates the darkness and makes it null and void. I feel it should resist Fire, Grass, and Electric, and that Light should be only weak to Poison since the Light becomes tainted by unknown substances. That's my general opinion so far. I feel we need more types, not just Light in order to maintain a keen balance for our former beloved Pokemon that suffer from their typing.

 

[Tangrowth]

I'm kind of changing my mind now because a lot of people are making a very strong case for the light type. I think it could work. I don't think it'll happen though, and I don't think Reshiram is Light type.

 

[swimfastray]

It makes me laugh honestly when people say we don't need new types, when its clearly obvious that we do. Look at the amount of Pokemon that are in OU+Uber compared to the amount of Pokemon that are in UU and under. And I'm not talking about type being what makes UU, UU. I'm saying that in UU, typing is what restricts powerful pokemon like Aggron, Rhyperior, and Magmortar.

I disagree that we need more types. Even the strongest OU and Uber pokemon have a huge weakness. I mean Garchomp stands no chance to an Ice move. There are things that help even out the game so that even UU pokemon can trump an Uber. (Not going so far to say an NU can trump an Uber) We don't need a new type to "balance the types". Why can't we just be happy with the types already established? The only reason Dark and Steel were added in Gen II is because Gen I had a bunch of kinks Gamefreak sought to fix, and the missing Dark and Steel-types were two of those kinks. I don't feel like there's any type missing since they introduced Dark and Steel.

Anyway I think the opposite of Dark, if there truly is one, would be Psychic. Even though Psychic doesn't affect Dark, it just seems logical. Espeon and Umbreon kind of hint at the two being kind of opposites as well.

I want to see a computer virus-like pokemon. It could have a new type combination: Electric/Poison. . . Just saying.

 

[Sevus]

I disagree that we need more types. Even the strongest OU and Uber pokemon have a huge weakness. I mean Garchomp stands no chance to an Ice move. There are things that help even out the game so that even UU pokemon can trump an Uber. (Not going so far to say an NU can trump an Uber) We don't need a new type to "balance the types". Why can't we just be happy with the types already established? The only reason Dark and Steel were added in Gen II is because Gen I had a bunch of kinks Gamefreak sought to fix, and the missing Dark and Steel-types were two of those kinks. I don't feel like there's any type missing since they introduced Dark and Steel.

Anyway I think the opposite of Dark, if there truly is one, would be Psychic. Even though Psychic doesn't affect Dark, it just seems logical. Espeon and Umbreon kind of hint at the two being kind of opposites as well.

I want to see a computer virus-like pokemon. It could have a new type combination: Electric/Poison. . . Just saying.

As far as Dark and Steel go, I don't think they were "missing" to begin with. If either Ghosts or Bugs had been worth using in R/B/Y (high-BP moves that weren't on part-Poison Pokémon), then Psychic wouldn't nearly have been as dominant as it was. The new types provided a hard counter to Psychics without having to rework the existing counters that much, but we could have easily only ever had the 15 original types. And Dark has made Psychic virtually unplayable except in the Psychic-saturated Ubers environment. (I think Azelf is still used as a suicide lead, but that's about it.)

Honestly, we never needed a new type beyond the initial 15. But Dark and Steel did bring something to the game, and I think a hypothetical Light-Type would too. I'm not expecting it to be added anymore, but I really think it would be useful.

Also, Garchomp required 269 Sp.Atk and you not to miss with Ice Beam due to Sand Veil to KO, assuming it didn't have a Yache Berry. But that conversation's been done to death. And Electric/Poison would be a cool type combination, if really Earthquake weak.

 

[plutoplanetpower]

Where did this ridiculous idea that the Fighting type equals honor/goodness come from? Just look at the Japanese and you'll understand. The Fighting type is called "kakutou" かくとう (格闘) which means like hand-to-hand fighting, grappling, struggling, a scuffle, etc. and this is definitely not a term used to mean any kind of upright honorable battle. Whoever thinks of the Fighting type as being upright and good is just imposing their views of an ideal moral warrior onto the entire type. While some Fighting types may be honorable such as Gallade, that is just their particular trait and most of the Fighting types are just about impressive physical power and/or fighting technique.

Similarly, the Dark type is called "aku" あく　(悪) which means evil/wicked. Most Dark types and Dark type moves have to do with lies, deception, trickery, scheming, stealing, etc. Darkness (as in the absence of light) is just an association with these ideas and some Dark types display these characteristics too. It is undeniable that the type is known as evil/dark but that doesn't mean that the individual Dark Pokemon are malevolent. Even if the Fighting type were supposed to be based on honor (which it's not), that would not make it an opposite to the Dark type. Punching someone in the face because they tricked you or had a nasty plot isn't exactly honorable anyway... It's still violence and I doubt many people would say that being strong or muscular is the opposite of dark/evil, so enough of this unfounded comparison!

As much as I would like to see a Light type, and how much it would fit with existing Pokemon, I don't think it will come through. If they had introduced a Light type at the same time as Dark and Steel, and made Espeon a Light type and Umbreon a Dark type, things might have worked out, but right now there doesn't seem to be much hope because:

1. It's been too long since the addition of new types so it's getting harder and harder to change the format (not impossible, but certainly more difficult). Would existing types change? Only new Pokemon could be Light types? Would move types change as well? (Light Screen, Solar Beam, etc.) Would they work it into the story by just saying they discovered a new land where Light types exist? It seems a little late for such a drastic change unfortunately :/

2. Many of the characteristics of a supposed Light type are already possessed by other types. Light is usually represented as being about goodness/cuteness, light as an energy/the sun, and mysticism/magic/holiness. The Normal type covers most of the goodness/cuteness attributes, some Electric and Fire types deal with light as energy/sun (Ampharos, Ho-oh), and some Psychic types cover the mystical aspect of Light (Espeon, Gardevoir, Solrock, etc.).

Believe me, I'd love to see a light type that balanced out the game and have older Pokemon that fit given the dual typing (such as Sunflora being Grass/Light), but it just seems a little complicated and too late for such a big change as well as the fact that several attributes of Light are already spread out amongst the other types.