Finished Mafia XXXV: Pokemon Card GB3: Team GR's Last Stand

[Camoclone]

Probably. Leaves me unsure whether RF is actually confotown or if PMJ had modified the results of the action already by that point.

Wait did he change the result he originally said?

 

[double o squirtle]

I think Celever's telling the truth about RF being town. If they were both scum, then I think it would be too risky to try and clear another teammate like that.

One last thing I want to say: I played absolutely terrible in Day 1, and I could’ve done so many things differently. I’m going to improve on what I did wrong and do my best to contribute.

This is AtE. Yet she did quite a bit of that in WW33 so it sort of reads towny to me.

So this is just a vote that doesn't count.

Why would you reveal that you have a vote weight of 0? That just helps scum.

 

[Celever]

Wait did he change the result he originally said?

No, but it's possible he changed the result before sending it to me, looking at that post. Maybe not, since he made the post a while after day start, though. Just worth thinking about.

 

[Camoclone]

I think Celever's telling the truth about RF being town. If they were both scum, then I think it would be too risky to try and clear another teammate like that.

...

 

[Scattered mind]

I seriously have a vote on me again. I don't know why

I am really surprised. I was sure it was your own effect or something. If it is not.. why does it say FS effect? Why would the host give away details about what targeted you? And also who would target you each time?

 

[Camoclone]

SM ISO Part 1.

##VOTE:bbninjas

How fun it is to vote without bold.

RVS.

Wishful thinking?

##UNVOTE
##VOTE:Celever

God. It's so fun to be able to vote on my phone.

RVS.

##UNVOTE
##VOTE:EXCALAURA

People asked you a very simple question. You didn't answer. (If you did then point me where cause I could not find it) . You most likely scumslipped.

Wagon. Nothing wrong yet.

Why would a new town player refuse to answer who told him to contribute ? Yes, there are other potential reasons, but it is more likely that he scumslipped and that his scumbuddies told him that.

Nothing wrong yet.

So you think all of the current cases are too weak?

Why do you think it is so weak?

@bbninjas- Just for you: A fine example of a scummy AtE.

I need to read back what is the case on quaking.

PikaMaster is acting the same as she did last game (that is mafia vs town). It's just that now she is under more pressure. I still need more evidence before deciding if she's scum or not.
Excal is the best option for today, as he most likely slipped and yeah I know,there is a chanse he didn't but this is d1 after all. We are probably not going to find a crazy case on anyone.
Unless of course quaking's case is better, which I still need to read about.

Translation: I don't know if blank is scum I need to check. Blank is most likely scum but maybe he isn't but we should still lynch him. We aren't going to lynch anyone but blank today. Maybe blank is scum but I need to check that too.

@quakingpunch73 Why did you twist the things Jesi said about scumhunting?
I still need to read back to better understand the part with camo in Celever's case.

Wagon. No individual thoughts.

You know, quaking does have a point about Excal. We can get a decent amount of info based on how many people wrote their opinion about the case on him.
@Celever I don't think quaking is less aggressive than past games. Or at least not to a great extant. Quaking's accusing Celever and Jesi for buddying is weird. Usually buddying is something people accuse someone because they defended someone else, not agreeing with a case.

Wagon.

I read it as : town quaking is a lot more aggressive in general. Now I read it again and yeah I misread it.

I am on my phone trying to read about the full case on quaking and to understand it.
So far this is what I understood:

Quaking twisted the things that Jesi had said about the fact that she is not sure how to start scumhunting, by saying that she had said she doesn't know how to scumhunt in general,thus lying about that.

Is that the core of the case on quaking?

Just a brief explanation about what I mean by core case-
The main thing that a case is made of, without other additional things, such as OMGUS AtE etc..(me just trying to create a new term)

As I have said, at the time before getting into understanding the case on quaking, I thought that the case on Excal is the best case. I am now trying to understand the case on quaking better, and it takes time for me since it is a case made by you, and therefore, requires a bit of time to fully understand. Not because it is hard to understand your cases, but because your cases are very good and long. And I am on my phone.

Translation: I just want to make you happy by agreeing with you.

Me too. Wasn't sure about it until he voted for you.

Anyway, I think it is a good time to ask for a vote count so we see where we stand.

Btw, why are you voting for quakingpunch? I mean, is that the same case Celever gave? I think you voted before Celever.

Thanks Celever.

##UNVOTE
##VOTE: Quakingpunch73

I am looking mainly on the prime reason in that case. Quaking has twisted the things that Jesi had said. On top of that, Quaking have not provife any valid respond to it, nor an explanation with quotes to show otherwise that the case is not true.

Wagon.

But what do you think about the main point on quakingpunch?

What do you mean? How do you know it was his plan to get lynched? He never revealed that

Important points from part one:

• All he does is bandwagon and try to make people happy. And it's not like he's a new player.
• A lot of questions. Questions aren't bad but when you are asking more questions than you are analyzing then there is a problem.
• He never seems to really know what is going on. He says "I need to read back". That's cute and stuff and there's nothing wrong with that as long as you weigh in sometime. SM never weighs in with anything important or relevant.

Stay tuned for part two.

 

[Camoclone]

SM ISO Part 2.

Oh.. sorry.

NP np.

Yeah, she also haven't answered my question.

Actually, Mia is indeed his biggest defender. Celever only said that quaking's case is better. Mia is the only one calling the case on Excal "extremely weak" with no explanation, as well as ignoring my request for why she thinks that.

@Miyami~~ It was bbninjas who first noted about Excal's problematic post.

I mean that bbninjas pointed it before Jesi had.

Ok, Excal's post has finally gave us a good answer to why she avoided the question. Simply put, they broke the OC rule and were afraid to be banned from the game. Btw, don't worry, you are new, noone is going to ban you forever on such a mistake (pretty sure it happened to other players here, which Im not going to name but they are more experienced. just don't do that again).

Thanks for clearing that up SM . I was really confused. What I'm even more confused about is how you let someone who you focused on for so long off so easy. Especially when they both alluded to this explanation.

Oh and btw @ExcalAura4D , now you can see the benefit of not finishing the day too early. For one thing, you managed to explain yourself, as well as getting people to read you more as town than scum.
(just answering your question of why not to hammer).

Yup! You are helping him out a lot!

In that case, let us end the day. Although it is kinda annoying that some players haven't said anything.

WHAT? Are you serious. I'm really confused. You just said there is a benefit to not finishing the day too early.

So Excal doesn't have vote weight of 2? If so, it is weird, after she implied that she does.

It does. They simply deduced it from the vote counts.

So.. why did quaking assume it was Excal with the double vote count, and not mordacazir?

So what do you think now?

Your vote is on TGK, so you mean that you still find tgk scummy? And what does Camo have to do with that? I guess I have missed something.

Questions questions questions. I'm disappointed. I expected more from a veteran.

How about now? What are your thoughts on what happened today?

Umm yeah, can anyone hammer? If we don't, there will be no lynch.

What's the reason you didn't think Keeper is scum ?

Your other point about Celever is kinda WIFOM, and I don't think we should give him towny points for that.

I am giving some tiny towny points for Vom, if anything, because he was fairly active (usually he is inactive when he is scum).

That's the kind of posts TGK makes when he is scum. The kind of posts where he is trying to appear like he is contributing but he is not.
Plus, he assumes that RF is clear, completely trusting Celever.

##VOTE:thegrovylekid

Possible role fish.

@TheFlyingPidove has claimed before the game started that she is going to be more active in the game. Possible sign for her being new scum.

It is because you have said in your own words that you will be way more active, giving me the impression that you might be scum- hence the inactivity.

Part two major points:

• Questions questions questions. No individual thoughts. He never actually adds anything relevant to the discussion.

 

[VinculumStellarum]

I am really surprised. I was sure it was your own effect or something. If it is not.. why does it say FS effect?

I don't understand where it says in this thread that it isn't his effect. If it wasn't, the FP effect would most likely jump from person to person each day, since it's like a passive ability.

Why would you reveal that you have a vote weight of 0? That just helps scum.

I did this in Mafia 33 and no one really made a big deal about it. However, my role then worked differently so it could be different here.

Addendum: Your vote weight is 0 during day two.

So this is just a vote that doesn't count.

I find the PMJ quote a little odd. Why specifically Day 2, and why only Day 2? Also, the PMJ quote had a link, but when I went to check it, PB couldn't find the page, so I'm sure this was quoted from the Role PM. (To check, go to the top page where the quote is and just hold your mouse over it. The website link should show up in the bottom left of your browser. It says "convMessage" multiple times in the link for me.) The lowercase "day two" also seems a little odd.
[quote="Scattered Mind]
@TheFlyingPidove has claimed before the game started that she is going to be more active in the game. Possible sign for her being new scum.
It is because you have said in your own words that you will be way more active, giving me the impression that you might be scum- hence the inactivity.
[/quote]
Even with the reasoning you've provided here, I don't think this pins her as scum right away. If she were scum, I'm sure her possible scumbuddies would've held her to her promise.

 

[Scattered mind]

Well, D1 I really thought it was an obvious slip. I knew there is a chanse that she didn't slip, but could not find a reason for it and thought that going for the simple answer (that it is a slip) is more likely the right answer. I mentioned the new case on quaking as it might be a legit case and so I asked about it and found it indeed legit.
It is still early in the game. We are just in D1 and it is quite normal for me to ask questions. Your claim about my lack of individual thoughts is false and you have convinietley skipped my case on TGK. I admit that I am not like bbninjas or Celever in making cases, but that doesn't mean I am scum. You should try better.

 

[Scattered mind]

D2*

 

[Scattered mind]

Even with the reasoning you've provided here, I don't think this pins her as scum right away. If she were scum, I'm sure her possible scumbuddies would've held her to her promise

That was my attempt to get her to post more.
Btw here is another prove for my infovidual thoughts.

 

[Camoclone]

This might be true. However, I'm also considering the level of activity, which may indicate that he is scum, as he is more active as town.

How does one's role has anything to do with their level of activity? You should be active and try to contribute regardless of your role.

The fact is- your level of activity matches your scum meta.

How does one's role have anything to do with your activity. When you are scum you don't contribute.

Wait a second? What?

This post gives me some townie vibes. I don't see him reacts like that as scum from some reason.

I don't know I just think this guy is town. I can't actually give you a reason.

How does KX react?

Luis did not call me out. He was referring to my case on TGK, as he dismissed it. Where is the Backpedal?
I don't mind if Luis will try to pressure me if he has any case on me. However, he does not have a case on me, nor did he try to find one.

I'm not scared of being pressured at all. I have 0 fear.

Ok at first I had a hard time to understand the KX case, but now I have read it and I am ready to comment on it :

As I understand, the case on KX is as followed:
In post 347 (C), KX says that he initially found quaking scummy, but after his claim KX says that he is not sure about it. So bb went to look where did KX state his thoughts on quaking before the claim, and found post number 261 (A). There- KX said that he agrees that quaking is being a little too harsh, but that it is quaking's normal play.
Now, this is what KX needs to answer to, and have not so far. If KX did not see quaking as scummy, why did he say later on that he had thought quaking is scummy ?

Simply put, it looks like KX kept saying quaking is not scummy/ not worth to lynch, so it is not clear why did he say in one point that he thought quaking was scummy before the claim.

Now is that your Core Case (main/most crucial point) on KX, @bbninjas ?

The only time that my role had any effect on my playstyle was indeed Pokemon Rangers, as I tried to be a NK target as much as possible.

However, the rest of the games, I always try to be as much active as possible and to contribute. I don't remember any other role that had any effect on my playstyle. (Besides the one time I was scum of course).

I have given him some tiny townie points for the townie vibes I got from his frustration. I do not agree with him. I think that tgk is scummy, and I don't see why I should take my vote from him. If tgk gets to be called scummy no matter what he does, then how can anyone check his posts?
While I agree that tgk is often get called for being scummy, it is not always have anything to do with his scum meta. Doing something scummy, does not mean that you are acting like your scum meta. In other games, tgk was called out for scummy things, but those things were not necessarily referred to his scum meta.
Additionally, tgk got called for acting like his scum meta a lot when he was town. That does not mean that we should stop trying to figure out what his scum meta is. I think that tgk is acting really similar to the time he was scum in the game where I was scum.

I did not agree with him at all because I covered myself by using no logic.

I'm not going to even comment on the rest of this post.

So he has already commented on the point I was commenting about ?

Speaking of @Luispipe8 , can you answer this?

If he was pressured by any means, it would be scummy. However, he was saying that out of frustration and as an example. I could be wrong about it, but this frustration sounds believable. This frustration alone though, does not mean he is town, hence the tiny townie points I gave him.

I think he's town but he might be scum.

Umm I really want to comment on it, but I think it is best to see what KX will say about it.

@King Xerneas - this is the main case on you, please answer.

I really don't want to say anything relevant to the game. Let me just ask another question instead.

Well, now that Celever has already commented on the KX case, might as well stop waiting.

This is what I wanted to post after KX comments:

bbninjas, this point is actually very weird. The jesi tag on excal was not a good explanation for Excal's post about someone telling him to contribute and vote. Even Jesi herself thought it was weird and voted Excal for that. No one thought that the tag alone is enough reason to drop all suspicion on Excal. Those who thought Excal is not scummy were only speculating that she probably talked to Jesi on skype. It was only later on page 19 post 378 that Excal explains about the Skype conversation with Jesi, which is way after all of KX posts about Excal.

The other point is more valid imo. After reading KX response to it, he said that he thought quaking is scummy, but was not sure about it since he think it is how quaking always react, and was even more unsure about it after the claim. So this could be the explanation for that point- that he simply didn't phrase himslef well. Thus, more evidence is needed before lynching him.

Let me just echo everything that people have already said.

I don't know if putting traps is only for scums. (Town Camoclone ?) However, if bbninjas intended to make his "stronger point" unnoticed and his weaker points more bolded, then yeah, this is kinda scummy, since the only reason to do that is when you know that your target is town, and as such, don't care about getting the truth.

Echo echo echo.

Then may I ask you @Celever, what exactly are you referring to when you are talking about baiting KX? If it is what I said, then could you give an example from bbninjas posts that proves his intention to make the smaller points more important than his main point?

Btw, I finished rereading the whole thing about Excal and I now understand that there are high chanses that either (if not both) Jesi or Excal is scum. Unless I am missing something , Excal explained that Jesi told him to contribute and vote, but Jesi stated earlier that she didn't talk with her, and even voted for Excal. So.. someone is lying.

This is gold considering his previous posts on Excal.

Sounds logical.

@TheFlyingPidove - Join the party (already).
You said you'll be active today. Try to read about what happened so you can comment about what you think.

@bbninjs - about the baiting issue, I agree that the point on KX about Excal didn't look like it is your main point. Therefore, I, for example, commented also on the weaker points. I think that is just one thing that proves how this strategy doesn't work. However, it is weird, because you did mention in the same post that the strong point is your main point.
Overall, it is too ..confusing. Not sure if it is scummy, since you did mention what is your main point, even though noone got it because of how insignificant it looks like. ( in the beginning of the post, like an intro to the real points you want to talk about).

@mordacazir - Have you read everything that was going on before the break? Are you ready to post your thoughts?

What do you think about Celever saying Reinforce is town?

I don't think that it would confirm Celever as scum. By that logic, you should already find Celever scum for leading the case on quakingpunch.

I was waiting for KX response for bbninjas without anyone else giving him the answer to see what he might say. I even said that beforehand.

Well this has been fun. It's been rather enlightening.

 

[Camoclone]

Well, D1 I really thought it was an obvious slip. I knew there is a chanse that she didn't slip, but could not find a reason for it and thought that going for the simple answer (that it is a slip) is more likely the right answer.

Well then why were you so obviously turned by such the defense?

I mentioned the new case on quaking as it might be a legit case and so I asked about it and found it indeed legit. It is still early in the game. We are just in D1 and it is quite normal for me to ask questions.

Your claim about my lack of individual thoughts is false and you have convinietley skipped my case on TGK. I admit that I am not like bbninjas or Celever in making cases, but that doesn't mean I am scum. You should try better.
Ah yes. I will try better.

 

[Camoclone]

*by such an obvious defense

 

[Scattered mind]

How does one's role have anything to do with your activity. When you are scum you don't contribute.

Wait a second? What?


I don't know I just think this guy is town. I can't actually give you a reason.




I'm not scared of being pressured at all. I have 0 fear.








I did not agree with him at all because I covered myself by using no logic.

I'm not going to even comment on the rest of this post.






I think he's town but he might be scum.


I really don't want to say anything relevant to the game. Let me just ask another question instead.


Let me just echo everything that people have already said.


Echo echo echo.




This is gold considering his previous posts on Excal.








Well this has been fun. It's been rather enlightening.

Now you are just twisting my words. You are trying to put a lot of things together to make sense, but it doesn't.

I never said that when you are scum you don't contribute. You are inserting words into my quotes without relating to their context.

Me trying to understand the case on KX is not an echo. Again.. twisting.

 

[Camoclone]

Your claim about my lack of individual thoughts is false and you have convinietley skipped my case on TGK

The one where you accuse him of being too trusting and where he tries to act like he's contributing? My bad! I don't count that since you are guilty of that x10.

 

[Scattered mind]

Turned by ? Sorry for my English. I am not sure what is the meaning of the phrase.

 

[Scattered mind]

The one where you accuse him of being too trusting and where he tries to act like he's contributing? My bad! I don't count that since you are guilty of that x10.

Again. Twistig. Actually wait.. you are replacing my case on tgk for another case you have just invented.

 

[Camoclone]

Again. Twistig. Actually wait.. you are replacing my case on tgk for another case you have just invented.

That's the kind of posts TGK makes when he is scum. The kind of posts where he is trying to appear like he is contributing but he is not.
Plus, he assumes that RF is clear, completely trusting Celever.

##VOTE:thegrovylekid

 

[Camoclone]

Checkmate.