Osama Bin Laden is dead.

[Pokequaza]

Jihad can refer to both the struggle for non violent causes and violent causes. In certain contexts it may translate to 'fighting against non-Islam people' or 'sacrificing one's life for an Islamic cause'. Therefor it can be used as some sort of equivalent to 'holy war', fighting for the sake of you religion.

 

[Shining Raikou]

Is it true that the treat in terrorism is high because of Bin Laden's Death?

The threat level was raised because there is a chance of retaliation.

 

[PMJ]

Who cares that bin Laden is dead? Seriously? It's not like "OMG BIN LADEN IS DEAD, WE HAVE WON AND TERRORISM AS WE KNOW IT IS OVER. WORLD PEACE <333"

Osama bin Laden is the love child of Waldo and Carmen Sandiego. I am not gonna believe this guy's really kicked it until we have irrefutable proof. Besides, even if he really is dead, another supreme leader is going to surface at some point and we'll be on the hunt for him too.

 

[XieRH]

Jihad means holy war..which for all intents and purposes is the same thing as terrorist attacks

Er no. It means "struggle", and the word is very open to certain interpretation on what you are struggling specifically for in a religious context

And even if it did mean as you said, a "holy war" is not terrorism. If it were, then the Roman Catholics were pretty big time terrorists back in the days of the Crusades, since they did classify that as a holy war.

IMO anyone who associates Jihad with Holy War has the same narrowed mindset as a terrorist, because AFAIK only the terrorists and extremists and radicalists use "Jihad" to define "Holy War". Well, them and the other stupid folk who make assumptions and jump to conclusions.


Please read the post below:

Jihad doesnt mean holy war, please get an education before making stupid remarks.

Osama bin Laden is the love child of Waldo and Carmen Sandiego.

Judging by his powers of hiding, I'm inclined to believe it's the other way round: They were his love children, and they were yet to learn all they can from him in the art of concealment.

 

[Fridge]

I'm pretty sure he's dead. I highly doubt they would fake an assassination now, years after any serious (debatable) Al Quaeda (sp?) activity. I don't see why they would fake his death now, it just doesn't seem like thats a possibility. I firmly believe he's gone. Besides, the reason the CIA gave for not releasing the photos does seem pretty fair - the pictures were incredibly gruesome. Its easy to go in all guns blazing with "ITS ALL A CONSPIRACY", but we've seen this all before: Moon landing, JFK's assassination.... not everything America does has to be a conspiracy. People need to put more faith in their governments.

His death won't mean a decrease in terrorist activity by any means, and as others have said, a new leader will arise. All in all, little has changed, but for what this man did it is undeniable that he deserved to die.

Like many have said I'm not entirely sure his death is something to celebrate, but it raises a mixture of emotions. As I said I believe he deserved to die for what he did, so many lives were lost because of his actions. But like with any other death, is a celebration in order? I think not. Many religions (I can vouch for Judaism here) support the death penalty, but they all state that death is not something to be celebrated, and it says in multiple places in Jewish texts that any death penalty that occurred was a sad event. I believe Islam has similar views, but I could be mistaken.

Also, just to clarify, the whole '72 virgins' thing doesn't actually have any Islamic basis so stop bringing it up. I can't quite remember who invented it, but I first heard about it from 'Family Guy', so I know for a fact its wrong.

Anyone who says anything derogatory about Islam or other religions (I'm referring to the dude who called Jihad terrorism mostly here I think), doesn't have any place posting here until they learn their facts.

20 pence.

 

[Ka$h Money]

@ Pokequaza

Jihad means 'Struggle'. It does not mean 'Struggle violently'. You have obviously accepted the way the media portrays the definition of Jihad.
As a result, you are no better than Bin Laden for altering the definition to suit you.

Jihad is mainly used as a reference to your own struggles, whether it be about religious aspects of your life or not. That is greater Jihad. Lesser Jihad is helping others with their struggles and helping the Muslim society and once that is completed helping the non-Muslim society.

Jihad does not mean holy war. Every respectable scholar of Islam agrees with my stance and I'm pretty sure they know about Islam a little more than you.

 

[Fridge]

^Dude, misunderstanding a term due to ignorance isn't something you should be comparing to mass murder. Okay he didn't know, that's not something you can say is 'no better than Bin Laden'.

 

[Pokequaza]

@ Pokequaza

Jihad means 'Struggle'. It does not mean 'Struggle violently'. You have obviously accepted the way the media portrays the definition of Jihad.
As a result, you are no better than Bin Laden for altering the definition to suit you.

Jihad is mainly used as a reference to your own struggles, whether it be about religious aspects of your life or not. That is greater Jihad. Lesser Jihad is helping others with their struggles and helping the Muslim society and once that is completed helping the non-Muslim society.

Jihad does not mean holy war. Every respectable scholar of Islam agrees with my stance and I'm pretty sure they know about Islam a little more than you.

I never claimed the that it solely meant struggle violently. I only said that it meant struggle whether it be with or without violence. In certain contexts it does indeed translate as struggle violently, and I only said that in those cases the word Jihad may loosely translate to an equivalent of 'holy war', provided it's a violent struggle for religious purposes.

Trust me, I would never use the media as a reference.

Yes I know, I slightly altered the translation of a word in your view, and this too will result numerous deaths. It appears that I'm indeed not better than Osama himself.

On a serious note; If altering a translation makes me 'not better than Osama', then I'm glad you are on this forum and not ruling a country or something of equivalent value.

 

[PMJ]

Hey kids can we play nice please? I would love to just lock this topic and be done with it but people gotta have their soapbox.

 

[Ka$h Money]

@ Pokequaza

Way to take something out of context. I guess thats what you done with your interpretation of Jihad and what you have done with my statement. Good day sir .

 

[Avrik]

Uhm, just got back to see this crazy convo, and the many mis interpretations of words.

Jihad, Definition. (among Muslims) A war or struggle against unbelievers

Also, I do not know who said that Islam is not violent...but just one second.


"...now that a Book confirming their own has come to them from God, they deny it...they reply: 'We believe in what was revealed to us.' But they deny what has since been revealed, although it is truth...Say: 'Whoever is an enemy of Gabriel' (who has by God's grace revealed to you [Muhammad] the Koran as a guide...confirming previous scriptures)..will surely find that God is the enemy of the unbelievers.'...And now that an apostle has come to them from God confirming their own Scriptures, some of those to whom the Scriptures were given cast off the Book of God behind their backs...The unbelievers among the People of the Book, and the pagans, resent that any blessings should have been sent down to you from your Lord. " (Surah 2:88-, 98-, 103-)

"Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)

"Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it." (Surah 2:216)

"Men are tempted [in this life] by the lure of women...far better is the return of God. Say: 'Shall I tell you of better things than these, with which the righteous shall be rewarded by their Lord? Theirs shall be gardens watered by running streams, where they shall dwell for ever: wives of perfect chastity..." (Surah 3:14, 15)

"The only true faith in God's sight is Islam." (Surah 3:19)

"Believers, do not make friends with any but your own people...They desire nothing but your ruin....You believe in the entire Book...When they meet you they say: 'We, too, are believers.' But when alone, they bite their finger-tips with rage." (Surah 3:118, 119)

"If you should die or be slain in the cause of God, His forgiveness and His mercy would surely be better than all the riches..." (Surah 3:156-)

"To those that declare: 'God has commanded us to believe no apostle unless he brings down fire to consume an offering,' say: 'Other apostles before me [Muhammad] have come to you with veritable signs and worked the miracle you asked for...If they reject you [Muhammad], other apostles have been rejected before you..." (Surah 3:183-)

"If you wish to replace a wife with another, do not take from her the dowry you have given her..." (Surah 4:20)

"Forbidden to you are...married women, except those you own as slaves." (Surah 4:20-, 24-)

"Believers, do not approach your prayers when you are drunk, but wait till you can grasp the meaning of your words..." (Surah 4:43)

"Seek out your enemies relentlessly." (Surah 4:103-)

"Try as you may, you cannot treat all your wives impartially." (Surah 4:126-)

"The Jews and Christians say: 'We are the children of God and His loved ones.' Say: 'Why then does He punish you for your sins?" (Surah 5:18)

"Believers, take neither Jews nor Christians for your friends." (Surah 5:51)

"The God will say: 'Jesus, son of Mary, did you ever say to mankind 'Worship me and my mother as gods besides God?' 'Glory to You, 'he will answer, 'how could I ever say that to which I have no right?" (Surah 5:114-)

"Believers, when you encounter the infidels on the march, do not turn your backs to them in flight. If anyone on that day turns his back to them, except it be for tactical reasons...he shall incur the wrath of God and Hell shall be his home..." (Surah 8:12-)

"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign supreme." (Surah 8:36-)

"If you fear treachery from any of your allies, you may fairly retaliate by breaking off your treaty with them." (Surah 8:51-)

"...make war on the leaders of unbelief...Make war on them: God will chastise them at your hands and humble them. He will grant you victory over them..." (Surah 9:12-)

"It ill becomes the idolaters [non-Muslims] to visit the mosques of God..." (Surah 9:17)

"Fight against such as those to whom the Scriptures were given [Jews and Christians]...until they pay tribute out of hand and are utterly subdued." (Surah 9:27-)

"It is He who has sent forth His apostle with guidance and the true Faith [Islam] to make it triumphant over all religions, however much the idolaters [non-Muslims] may dislike it." (Surah 9:31-)

"If you do not fight, He will punish you sternly, and replace you by other men." (Surah 9:37-)

"Prophet make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them. Hell shall be their home." (Surah 9:73)

"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them." (Surah 9:121-)

"Say: 'Praise be to God who has never begotten a son; who has no partner in His Kingdom..." (Surah 17:111)


Just some quotes...

 

[Chemical]

From Yahoo and quoted from the News.
"The soldiers who stormed bin Laden's hideout are unflinching and unknown." 'They're not killers — they're survivors'

What really pisses me off is that fact that they insist that they are not killers! It is an outrage because they did kill somebody, sure he was evil and all and they did survive but not killers I believe is the most crap they could have said! They killed someone so they are killers, no matter if they killed a horrible person or not.

 

[Cinesra]

@Avrik, You can pick out texts from any religious book and use them out of context and make it sound as if that religion is violent.

 

[Avrik]

@Avrik, You can pick out texts from any religious book and use them out of context and make it sound as if that religion is violent.

Oh no, I completely agree, just trying to make a point to those who are saying the Islamic religion is peaceful. The issue with modern Islam is that most of the Taliban, Al-qaeda and many other muslim fanatics seem to be living in the past. Where modern Christianity lives by the new testament and teachings of peace amongst men. This statement is not to be confused at all to say I am saying all muslims are fanatical, violent, crazies, Turkey for instance is mainly a muslim country, but they stand apart from the Middle-east.

@chemical True, they are killers, they are killers I agree with. I've seen many around my campus preach pacifism and such, but in all honesty for that to work we must cooperate. We have seen peace through-out the world in many civilized countries, but when someone swings a stick around, we must destroy that stick before it destroys far to many others, such as Iraq, and Afganistan.

 

[Ka$h Money]

Just after giving a speech about manipulating statements and quotes for your own agenda, I see it done again. Stop taking stuff out of context. If you honestly believe Islam promotes terrorism, why isn't their more of these terrorist attacks? Surely with 1.5 billion Muslims in the world, there would be a little more attacks than there are now.

 

[Avrik]

Just after giving a speech about manipulating statements and quotes for your own agenda, I see it done again. Stop taking stuff out of context. If you honestly believe Islam promotes terrorism, why isn't their more of these terrorist attacks? Surely with 1.5 billion Muslims in the world, there would be a little more attacks than there are now.

Kashmaster, though what you say is true you need to understand that they are the most fanatical of organized religions within our world and time. I also believe that you are only referring to the times of attacks that the news broadcasts, please you need to do your research before completely understanding the motives and just how frequent these attacks are. For instance this is refereeing to a website with graphic material, but go through www.truthtube.tv, there you might find brutality of muslim fanatics.

Like I have stated before, I have no problem with muslims, I have no problem with the religion of Islam, I have an issue with fanatics. Like Christianity during the crusades, or with the Spanish inquisition there are low times of religion, Islam is hitting it's current one now.

 

[PG24]

@Chemical:

Sorry, the justice system just doesn't work like that. Even if we didn't kill Osama, he would be trialed and sentenced to death by hanging / lethal injection / firing squad / electric chair. The only difference is we get a heroic feeling when we get the job done ourselves.

I love that they killed him right then and there. A man as evil as that doesn't deserve to live longer while he goes on trial. Like I said before, there is no difference; he would've died ether way.

The difference is what? He dies ether way.

 

[Chemical]

My point is they are saying they are not killers yet they are. It's like if I killed a guy who murdered 25 people in my states, am I not a killer then?

 

[Pokequaza]

@ Pokequaza

Way to take something out of context. I guess thats what you done with your interpretation of Jihad and what you have done with my statement. Good day sir .

Then I am really interested where I took anything out of context. Would you mind being a little bit more specific?

 

[cataha]

I just heard that Obama will not be releasing any photos of Osama Bin Laden. Weird? Yes.