PokeBeach's Official 5th Gen Ban List

RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Complexy990 said:
The reason Smogon avoids complex bans as heavily as it does is because it tries to stay as close to the game as possible. If you remove speed boost from blaziken and allow it with blaze, then you have to allow garchomp when rough skin gets released, etc. etc.

It causes unneeded complication and would make the metagame A LOT harder than it already is to get into. It makes a lot more sense to just fully ban pokemon if any part of them makes them unisuitable/OP for their tier.
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I already know that. I'm just saying I wouldn't be against the idea of banning on the basis of ability, but I would be against anything more than that (e.g. moveset).

not saying I have a problem with the banlist system the way it is now, but there is a little wiggle room possible
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Dragonite is overrated. All of its sets have some drawbacks and there are several Pokemon that are necessary to check other threats that handle Dragonite well.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Kevin Garrett said:
Dragonite is overrated. All of its sets have some drawbacks and there are several Pokemon that are necessary to check other threats that handle Dragonite well.
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this. and lol Dragonite is nowhere near what Salamence was in Gen4. Not even close.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Bunch of new DW abilities are out.

coolhole2.png


I think Mamoswine just got a bit better. :]
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Mamoswine really needs to get Swords Dance somehow for me to start caring. :p

Sand Rush Sandslash however is sort of interesting.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Let's keep this thread focused on suggested bans/unbans, please.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

It kind of is on topic since DW releases are "unbanned" and allowed to be used in standard play. Why do you think we have a list of released DW abilities on the OP? Unless you want to make a thread on DW releases, this thread is the only place to discuss that stuff.

plus it means this thread isn't dead

I went ahead and added the new Kyurem formes to the OP and removed Keldeo. I'll work on updating the DW list later this week.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Is PokeBeach planning on allowing Soul Dew for the time being? And are we going to play around with Kyurem-B/W before automatically booting them?
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

It will have to be put up as a vote. I'd say Soul Dew should be banned based on how strong it really makes Latios and Latias. They can already wreck teams enough without the free Special Attack and Special Defense boost. In Ubers it will be fine. Kyurem formes I'd rather have be suspect now just to see exactly what it is capable of especially with all the move tutors.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

I think we should unbann Swift Swim + Drizzle. Sand is the new dominant weather, and I don't see it working as well anymore as it use to.

Also, I've seen the Kyurem forms, they don't do that well in battle. They are OHKO'd by a lot.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Martini said:
I think we should unbann Swift Swim + Drizzle. Sand is the new dominant weather, and I don't see it working as well anymore as it use to.

Also, I've seen the Kyurem forms, they don't do that well in battle. They are OHKO'd by a lot.
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Hahaha, this made me laugh. Sand is the worse weather now along with hail. Go play a game on Showdown and try to go ten games without seeing less than seven rain teams.

The new Kyurem formes posses so many things that, when added up, make them broken; unpredictability, crazy offenses, mixed attacking stats, great bulk, and an okay speed tier. Most of all it had the ability to OHKO or 2HKO everything in the game. You could say it's like Dragonite in the fact that it can KO two to three Pokemon before dying, however Kyurem can start doing this from the start whereas Dragonite can usually not.

I would say that now that we have Ditto, TechniLoom, and Scizor that Kyurem is easier to handle, however a Substitute set can easily dispatch of these three. I would love to test them but I feel they will still be broken.

The other reason I want them banned is because most everyone who plays BW2 plays on Showdown which has Kyurem formes banned.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Uhh, what? Rain teams are everywhere dude. Tornadus-T, Thundurus-T and Keldeo all love having Politoed around, and at least one of them is on at least 80% of teams. Rain is already really powerful, so why make it more powerful?

I want to play with Soul Dew a bit myself before I jump to the banhammer. Personally, I think it could be healthy for the metagame as it can create more diversity by creating more sand teams while decreasing the amount of rain teams.

I haven't used the Kyurem formes yet, but from what I've seen, they're pretty overpowered. Especially Kyurem-R, as it gets unresisted three move coverage off of its 170 Base attack due to Turboblaze, just like Reshiram. Yes, they do have a terrible defensive typing and lacklustre speed. But they are incredibly difficult to switch in against due to the massive amounts of fire power behind their attacks.

Timid Specs White Kyurem Draco Meteor vs. Great Wall Lugia: 65.38 - 77.16%

Adamant Life Orb Black Kyurem Outrage vs 252/252 Groudon: 48.3% - 56.7%, guaranteed 2hko with Spikes

If that's what they do in Ubers, then I don't want to see that in OU.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Sand is the worse weather now along with hail.
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Even worse than sun? What on earth did I miss?

I would say that now that we have Ditto
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Wait, they released Imposter? Where!?

If that's what they do in Ubers, then I don't want to see that in OU.
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Kyurem is like a Deoxys-A that can actually take a hit without dying. Do not want.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

I kind of said that wrong. Sand is still there but it's not as good as rain or even sun somewhat (Giga Drain Venusaur is really good). Stuff like Keldeo and Tornadus give sand a hard time, but sand also got Amoonguss, Keldeo, Sand Rush Sandslash. and Superpower dog thing (I'm drawing blanks here).

I probably shouldn't have said it's with hail. It's more like rain > sun = sand > hail.

Stoutland

[mod] ~ R-C[/mod]
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Bippa said:
Timid Specs White Kyurem Draco Meteor vs. Great Wall Lugia: 65.38 - 77.16%

Adamant Life Orb Black Kyurem Outrage vs 252/252 Groudon: 48.3% - 56.7%, guaranteed 2hko with Spikes

If that's what they do in Ubers, then I don't want to see that in OU.
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That is too frightening. 0.0 Great Wall Lugia is supposed to be a monster...but, it's not with that thing around. Hmm. Could you calculate

Modest Specs White Kyurem Draco Meteor vs Great Wall Lugia ... o.0

- R-C
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Yes, at least sand got new toys. Hail got nothing, as per usual.

Looking a bit at Soul Dew, I'm thinking it would be wise to ban it. Latios and Latias are two excellent Pokemon in the metagame, so making them more powerful through the use of an item doesn't bode well with me. Allowing the item may weaken rain and strengthen sand, but as a whole, it makes Latios and Latias unbalanced in the metagame. I still do want to test it, but it seems like it would cause centralization by existing.

Smogon banned it in their DW tier (which is like this new meta without Excadrill, Thundurus, Garchomp, Manaphy, Genesect and Chandeure, but with Therian genies), if that says anything about its power.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Well, I need to test Soul Dew but I personally believe its got a great place in the metagame. If we're allowing offensive monsters like Keldeo and Thundurus-T into the metagame, I think Soul Dew will have a place.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

One idea might be to unban Exca, and see if that gives sand more usage.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Bippa said:
Timid Specs White Kyurem Draco Meteor vs. Great Wall Lugia: 65.38 - 77.16%

Adamant Life Orb Black Kyurem Outrage vs 252/252 Groudon: 48.3% - 56.7%, guaranteed 2hko with Spikes

If that's what they do in Ubers, then I don't want to see that in OU.
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Ok, now that's just scary ._. I believe the only way you can deal with both of these guys is to swap in a Steel-type when/if they're locked into Outrage
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

after a few battles on PO, I really do think that soul dew + Latios/Latias should be banned, You CM twice, and you get unbearable sweeps. It's truly great, too great actually.
 
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