I would definetly agree. I would also think it's for the jolteon-EX matchup
Water Toolbox - Seismitoad-EX / Manaphy-EX / Articuno
- Thread starter Asclepius24
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I would think with the Meta of item locking decks, specifically one in particular that not only locks a very dependant and item heavy deck like this, but also for the fact that you're weak to one of the item locking decks (VV) which can get item lock T1 and create a lot of havoic if you can't use your items at all. Not running a single Hex Maniac seems idiotic to me. Not only can it be used to get out of an early item locking situation, but you can also T2 Hex Maniac AND Quaking Punch against most decks which creates quite a disturbance in the top tier decks setup abilities.
against Greninja, the goal isn't item lock them, or set a Glaceon ex to lock the attack damage (water shuriken is an ability, which passthrough the effect). Go explosive T1, try to set articuno with fighting fury belt, it usually does 70 damages by tri edge (all I ask for is just 1 head out of 3 coin flip). you may take 4 prizes on first 2 turns which is hard for Greninja to comeback.
Greninja hasn't established itself as a top deck? LOL
I get the strategy behind this and it makes sense, but it's all based upon chance. Chance you don't start with hoopa as active, chance you hit your max elixirs and chance that you get lucky on the rolls. Not saying this cant work, but like you said, you have to be explosive and go all out T1. I've never tried this before so I can't say for sure how easy it is to accomplish, but I can see it working, if a little luck is on your side.
of course starting with Hoopa ex is not ideal, but unlike other decks that you got to dig for the one of Az, or 1-2 of float stone, all you need for free retreat is a water energy and a Manaphy ex on bench. the water energy attachment does seem like a waste on Hoopa ex, but the 3 energy switches gurantee you in getting back the energy to your attackers later, if not the same turn.
this deck plays 12 water energy (some play 11), so max elixir successful rate should be high, when my opponent mad at my continous max elixir attachment, they just don't realize how many basic energy i played. that's deck structuring mostly, with a bit lucki would say.
this deck requires a good understanding of the meta. on the first turn when your opponent reveal his starter (assume its not a lone shaymin ex or hoopa ex), you should plan for setting up which pokemon and discarding which. e.g. when you face Toad/Tina, set Regice with sufficient energy on it (hammer!), you win; when you see a combee. set Glacen ex as chance of they play a heavy base hitter is low; when you see a froakie, set articuno, try to get 4 prizes from it before a greninja comes out.
just my 2 cents
Lugia is Rarely used and Yveltal has 2 Great backup attackers that destroy regice b4 it does anything useful id rather use glaceon as it makes it so that you bait the yveltal ex to active and knock it out.
I'd suggest adding in an Escape Rope so you aren't locked out of the game by Jolteon-EX.
Back when I was running a deck similar to this, I opted to run a 2-2 line of Huntail since Powerful Storm aligned very well with the deck and gave me an answer to Jolteon-EX and Pyroar. Maybe that could work? I don't know.
No mew? He makes sure your opponent only takes one prize and allows for all your affects in one card (except articuno) plus free retreat
bad idea. all pokemon is this deck can utilize rough sea to heal and manaphy ex for free retreat, so as to prevent KO. Mew just gives out prizes too easily
Idk maybe 1 or 2 wouldn't hurt... your choice though :/
i think that the card that should make the difference is not here yet: ninja boy would be perfect!
I'm only waiting to put at least one copy in this deck.
This deck doesn't need escape rope for me!
I've put an AZ (useful to remove targets from the play area, not only to st up) and two manaphy EX, so no lock. And with regice you can completely stall the game using multiple times resistance blizzard against his jolteon and wait for the deck over of your opponent.
I'm only waiting to put at least one copy in this deck.
This deck doesn't need escape rope for me!
I've put an AZ (useful to remove targets from the play area, not only to st up) and two manaphy EX, so no lock. And with regice you can completely stall the game using multiple times resistance blizzard against his jolteon and wait for the deck over of your opponent.
Hi guys. What tech would you use against a Joelton-EX deck ? I faced some and I was easily beaten.
Last time I played a deck like this, I used a 2-2 line of Huntail. That could probably work.
Out of curiosity, has anyone here ever run an Archie's Swampert variation of this deck? It seems like something that could meld well with Max Elixir and Trainers' Mail.
Using 3 Batltle Compressors 3 trainers mail and 4 max elixers on top of ultra balls allows for a pretty good chance of pulling off and archie. in my playtesting with empoleon ive pulled off the archie every game usually by turn 2 or or 3. Im starting to think a better way to play this deck however is with Maxies Gallade gives you an answer to jolteon and manectric and with just 2 DCE's and 10 waters you max elixer will hit allot and you will have an alternate way to get the quacking punch. Also Premeditation is terrific
Yeah, but unlike with Maxie, Archie lets you use Swampert, who has a stronger search engine in exchange for being more vulnerable to Lysandres, on top of all the other mainstays in your Water Box deck. Diving Search can also weave together stronger combos with Max Elixir and Trainers' Mail, which means you don't have to improv as much like you would with Gallade.
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However swampert Cant OHKO a Jolteon Easily and charging up a Gallade and doing 130 with it is considerably easier. also while diving search is better, diving search is also very obvious so an opponent might N just to make sure you dont get that one card in your deck that would change the match where as Premeditation has a little mystery for your opponent.
Well, you can use Diving Search to make sure that you're going to hit what you want with your in hand Trainers' Mail/Max Elixir/ any drawing card. That's before you attack, so your opponent can't do anything. And if you don't draw the top card in your turn, not always your opponent will be able to play N, since maybe he/she needs to use Lysson, AZ, the new Pokemon Ranger if he/she is under Quacking Punch...