Finished Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Members win!

[Jeremy1026]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Not digging this "is this my roll or not" game that Reinforce is playing. Something seems very off about it. If we believe it, jokes on us at this point.

 

[Cinesra]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Not digging this "is this my roll or not" game that Reinforce is playing. Something seems very off about it. If we believe it, jokes on us at this point.

Pretty much this. It feels like some scummy attempt at covering his ass.

 

[Kecleon-X]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

i entirely don't believe the claim.. and now i'm more confirmed to not believing it

Exactly my thoughts. This is an odd play for Reinforce to do, and, honestly? That was kind of a jerk move just giving up the ghost to someone else when he almost gets lynched, whether he meant to do so or not.

 

[Reinforce]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Yes, that is actually the role that I inherited from Cobalt Phoenix. Not a single word was changed from what he revealed.

At this point, I have no reason to lie, and frankly, there's nothing else I can do.

 

[Kecleon-X]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

I was speaking of Cobalt, right there. Just as a clarification.

 

[Keeper of Night]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

I'm actually very sorry for this:

If you don't and you think Cobalt Phoenix's/my role is completely different, it would mean we'll ignore that and I would be entering the game in a clean slate, with my role unknown.

Obviously, this is going to affect how I play.

So... Is it a yes or no?

First of all, Cobalt was way to willing to role reveal. This, to me, seems like it was a safe-claim, since the purpose of safe-claims is to have a claim in the first place.
Secondly, if this was your role, you'd have no reason to be saying this, because it'd be your whole role. The only reason to ask this is if you wanted to be able to add on to it later and not be suspected. Obviously, if that was your role, that would be impossible. However, if it's a fake-claim, like I suspect, you'd have all the reason in the world to do so.
Third, you're just causing confusion and not giving straight answers. This makes me even more suspicious of you.

All in all, I'm sorry Cobalt left you such a mess, maybe he hoped you'd be able to do better than he did. However, I was convinced yesterday Cobalt was scum, and I'm still convinced even after the role changed hands.

##VOTE: Reinforce

 

[WanderingWolf]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Good morning everyone, I'm on board here now in place of Cobalt Phoenix, inherited and received his role, and I think I've been left in a bit of a dilemma.

Yeah, to some extent.

I need to ask you guys: Do you believe Cobalt Phoenix's role reveal a few pages back?

No. We've already kind of discussed whether we believe Cobalt to be town or not, half of us chose wolf, a quarter of us chose town and the rest didn't care and wanted Keeper dead.

Here it is, if clicking and following links is not your thing.

Role: Meaty
Alignment: Members

You are Meaty, a member of PokeBeach Forums. You heard a rumor that WPM was meatier than you. That is obviously not true, but you're rebelling because it's fun.

Passive Effect: Meaty
If you would be killed at night, you will die at the end of the next day instead of the end of the current night. During that day, your vote weight is zero.

Win Condition: All non-Members eliminated

Thanks for making this pointless mini-wall of text bigger.

If you do believe that, it would make Cobalt Phoenix/me confirmed town. And also a town whose death wouldn't be much of a loss since it's not a powerful or useful role.

It really wouldn't since, safe-claims are in the game, this game usually has a bunch of skeptics on everything, and the wolves/Porygon could possibly have a faction changer.

If you don't and you think Cobalt Phoenix's/my role is completely different, it would mean we'll ignore that and I would be entering the game in a clean slate, with my role unknown.

Roles don't change after substitution, neither do safe claim, actually. So, no. I don't. Although I do think you and Cobalt have the same role. Actually, I know, and so should everyone else.

Obviously, this is going to affect how I play.

I think Cobalt in general basically sets your playstyle in stone: defending your ass and do nothing else.

So... Is it a yes or no?

No. After this massive unhelpful post (yeah, this one isn't too helpful either), that's using his 'trustworthy' words to convince us, and stating the same thing that most of us have already said/answered, I'm going to have to vote this 'confirmed town'.

##MURDER: PORYGON-X

Oh wait, wrong confirmed town.

##UNMURDER: PORYGON-X
##REMURDER: REINFORCE

Also, in future, Cobalt, don't sub out and leave the mess for he next person right when you're about to be lynched. It's poor sportsman ship, and basically confirms that you have nothing else to defend yourself with.

 

[Reinforce]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

@KoN Nah, you don't have to apologize. When I found out I was going to be subbed in for Cobalt Phoenix, I knew it would be hard to salvage. If I went with the role reveal, it come out as suspicious for being way too willing to reveal. If I claimed it was false, then I'm only more suspicious because I'd be semi-confirming it as a safe-claim. And also:

Yes, that is actually the role that I inherited from Cobalt Phoenix. Not a single word was changed from what he revealed.

At this point, I have no reason to lie, and frankly, there's nothing else I can do.

If I said yes it is my role even if I can't prove it, would you believe me?

Your reaction and thought process is as I expected, and I would think so too if I were in your place. And I was prepared for people not believing me at all even if I told the truth, see that question I posed before the post where I said yes, it was my role? Yeah.

And what I meant about it affecting how I play is that basically I was walking around with a flashing sign on my head proclaiming my role from the very moment I entered the game.

@ Wandering Wolf
Thanks.

Hopefully, this current view of yours on me won't carry on to future Werewolf games.

 

[WanderingWolf]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Hopefully, this current view of yours on me won't carry on to future Werewolf games.

To be fair, we don't really have a view on you. You're mainly getting called out because of our view on Cobalt. Although, I dislike the fact that the 5 posts you've made have already just been unhelpful/defensive, which is exactly what cobalt did.

 

[Cinesra]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Yeah, WW and K-ON(kek) have pretty much given my reasoning already a couple of posts above this one, so:

##tickle: Reinforce

 

[sillykyle]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Also lol @ sillykyle's role.

ikr, couldn't have done it better myself.

On a side note, now that my mason buddy is dead, I see no real reason not to claim. I'm Porygon-X, mason buddy with the late Kecleon-X. I have no other abilities, and it seems the wolves tried to kill me last night. COME AT ME SCUM

 

[sillykyle]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Err wait did the wolves try to kill the role Porygon-X or the player Porygon-X?

 

[Athena]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

I believe they tried to kill the player Porygon-X, based on how other nightplot lines have worked, with role names only being shown in role quotes.

Also, yeah, I got approximately 7 red flags with reinforce's "is this my role or not?" post. I feel a bit late to the game with this, but ##raygun: Reinforce

 

[Celever]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Hmm... I don't really like this lynch on cobalt/reinforce. This lynch has been far too easy to pull, leading me to believe that at least 1 of the main advocators are scum, and if you look at the kill last night it was Camoclone, who attacked Cobalt Phoenix the most yesterday. Basic mafia strategy dictates that killing someone who is the main advocator for your lynch as scum is idiotic as all hell, however it is a rather common strategy for mafia to nightkill someone who advocated a lynch on a scummy townie, trying to frame them for the kill.

However, if we look at the flavour, it looks like it wasn't the mafia who killed Camo - it was the Serial Killer. Why would the SK want Camo dead? To frame KoN of course! While I certainly believe that Keeper is SK less now, I can see Keeper killing Camo just because of the fact that Camo wasn't the biggest advocator yesterday iirc, but he was still a large one.

Another theory I have is that CP is actually the SK, and knowimg that everyone suspects him as a mafia rather than a SK he could kill Camo with little suspicion caused by it, however I feel that this is somewhat unlikely.

However scummy this looks, though, can I just say "Thank You" to the SK for killing Camo. I should be able to post more here when I don't take twice as long reading the posts as it takes typing one up...

Reinforce phrasing his posts the way he did... There's nothing wrong with that, if I'm being honest here. I mean, sure, he said it... Actually no, I don't even understand how it is scummy! He said "hypothetically, if I were to claim this role, would you believe me?" If he said "Hey guys, just confirming that this is my role!" You would all lynch him because you don't like the claim. However, what he said achieved what I think he wanted to do, which was just know everyone else's standing on his roleclaim from the previous day. He did this quite well, obviously, as he found out the people hate it so much they want him dead...

First people which come to mind as bandwagoning on this lynch are Kecleon-X and Cinesra (iPad, so I can't check back) so I will go ahead and ##CAMOUFLAGE: Kecleon-X.

tl;dr I am against a Reinforce lynch due to the kills last night and I don't see anything particularly wrong with Reinforce's phrasing. I am slightly more suspicious of KoN, but I am in two minds about it. Pointless bandwagoners on this lynch are scummy; so are main advocators.

 

[Reinforce]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Let me summarize my situation.

1) If I didn't bring the Cobalt reveal issue up: someone else was sure to bring it up, and then I'll get called out for dodging the obvious issue and trying to hide or distract everyone. I'd come off suspicious for this.

2) If I claimed Cobalt's reveal was false: Obvious lying is obvious. I'm hiding something about my role, and perhaps it could be wolf. I'm definitely suspicious.

3) If I claimed Cobalt's reveal was true: Well, you can't say I didn't try. And as I expected, no one believed. I get called defensive. And it's still suspicious.

It's a lose-lose-lose situation.

And if I were to try to just jump directly into helpful discussion like you suggest, look back at #1. If I had given my helpful discussion opinions on my first post, it'll just be ignored while you all accuse me of dodging the issue and distracting you. Or am I mistaken about this prediction?

Reinforce phrasing his posts the way he did... There's nothing wrong with that, if I'm being honest here. I mean, sure, he said it... Actually no, I don't even understand how it is scummy! He said "hypothetically, if I were to claim this role, would you believe me?" If he said "Hey guys, just confirming that this is my role!" You would all lynch him because you don't like the claim. However, what he said achieved what I think he wanted to do, which was just know everyone else's standing on his roleclaim from the previous day. He did this quite well, obviously, as he found out the people hate it so much they want him dead...

Dang. Celever, you read my mind or something?

 

[Cinesra]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Hmm... I don't really like this lynch on cobalt/reinforce. This lynch has been far too easy to pull, leading me to believe that at least 1 of the main advocators are scum, and if you look at the kill last night it was Camoclone, who attacked Cobalt Phoenix the most yesterday. Basic mafia strategy dictates that killing someone who is the main advocator for your lynch as scum is idiotic as all hell, however it is a rather common strategy for mafia to nightkill someone who advocated a lynch on a scummy townie, trying to frame them for the kill

Or they could be using reverse psychology. Not saying they are, but it's a possibility.
[/quote]However, if we look at the flavour, it looks like it wasn't the mafia who killed Camo - it was the Serial Killer. Why would the SK want Camo dead? To frame KoN of course! While I certainly believe that Keeper is SK less now, I can see Keeper killing Camo just because of the fact that Camo wasn't the biggest advocator yesterday iirc, but he was still a large one. [/quote] Again, reverse psychology is still an option. They could want you to think that to fall right into their trap.

Reinforce phrasing his posts the way he did... There's nothing wrong with that, if I'm being honest here. I mean, sure, he said it... Actually no, I don't even understand how it is scummy! He said "hypothetically, if I were to claim this role, would you believe me?" If he said "Hey guys, just confirming that this is my role!" You would all lynch him because you don't like the claim. However, what he said achieved what I think he wanted to do, which was just know everyone else's standing on his roleclaim from the previous day. He did this quite well, obviously, as he found out the people hate it so much they want him dead...

The fact that he even said that at all makes me suspect him. "Hey, guy's I'm TOTALLY TOWN. Nope, not a wolf, no sir.

First people which come to mind as bandwagoning on this lynch are Kecleon-X and Cinesra (iPad, so I can't check back) so I will go ahead and ##CAMOUFLAGE: Kecleon-X.

tl;dr I am against a Reinforce lynch due to the kills last night and I don't see anything particularly wrong with Reinforce's phrasing. I am slightly more suspicious of KoN, but I am in two minds about it. Pointless bandwagoners on this lynch are scummy; so are main advocators.
[/quote]

 

[Cinesra]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Shit, accidentally hit enter. Please disregard my previous post/ignore the double post and let me try this again:

Hmm... I don't really like this lynch on cobalt/reinforce. This lynch has been far too easy to pull, leading me to believe that at least 1 of the main advocators are scum, and if you look at the kill last night it was Camoclone, who attacked Cobalt Phoenix the most yesterday. Basic mafia strategy dictates that killing someone who is the main advocator for your lynch as scum is idiotic as all hell, however it is a rather common strategy for mafia to nightkill someone who advocated a lynch on a scummy townie, trying to frame them for the kill

Or they could be using reverse psychology. Not saying they are, but it's a possibility.

However, if we look at the flavour, it looks like it wasn't the mafia who killed Camo - it was the Serial Killer. Why would the SK want Camo dead? To frame KoN of course! While I certainly believe that Keeper is SK less now, I can see Keeper killing Camo just because of the fact that Camo wasn't the biggest advocator yesterday iirc, but he was still a large one.

Again, reverse psychology is still an option. They could want you to think that to fall right into their trap.

Reinforce phrasing his posts the way he did... There's nothing wrong with that, if I'm being honest here. I mean, sure, he said it... Actually no, I don't even understand how it is scummy! He said "hypothetically, if I were to claim this role, would you believe me?" If he said "Hey guys, just confirming that this is my role!" You would all lynch him because you don't like the claim. However, what he said achieved what I think he wanted to do, which was just know everyone else's standing on his roleclaim from the previous day. He did this quite well, obviously, as he found out the people hate it so much they want him dead...

The fact that he even said that at all makes me suspect him. "Hey, guy's I'm TOTALLY TOWN. Nope, not a wolf, no sir. The way he went about doing it feels pretty scummy to me. Plus, Cobalt was suspicious yesterday. I'm not entirely sold on Reinforce being a wolf either, but there's something about him that feels pretty scummy and I'm acting on my gut instinct. He's the best option we have, imo.

First people which come to mind as bandwagoning on this lynch are Kecleon-X and Cinesra (iPad, so I can't check back) so I will go ahead and ##CAMOUFLAGE: Kecleon-X.

tl;dr I am against a Reinforce lynch due to the kills last night and I don't see anything particularly wrong with Reinforce's phrasing. I am slightly more suspicious of KoN, but I am in two minds about it. Pointless bandwagoners on this lynch are scummy; so are main advocators.

So because people disagree with you, they're "pointless bandwagoners"? Why vote for Kecleon-X and not for people who actually voted for Reinforce like Athena, myself, K-ON, or Wandering Wolf?

 

[Reinforce]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

The fact that he even said that at all makes me suspect him. "Hey, guy's I'm TOTALLY TOWN. Nope, not a wolf, no sir.

So you mean, instead of testing the waters first and being hypothetical, I should have jumped the gun and claimed that it was my true role (which would have made me look suspicious AND stupid for claiming something no one believed apparently, which I only found out after what I did today) or claimed that it was a false reveal (thereby showing that I have something to hide and thus making me suspicious before I could explain myself)?

Or are you suggesting there was a fourth option I could have taken aside from saying a direct yes, direct no or asking what if? Enlighten me, please.

And I already explained why avoiding the issue on my first post was not an option I could have taken.

 

[Machamp The Champion]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

Camo flipped town? Really? That actually really surprises me. I was pretty convinced he was scum. Well, I guess I was wrong.

@Reinforce, I gotta say, you aren't really coming off as scum to me. Although, you hasn't really addressed anything besides defending yourself. Reinforce, who do you think is scum?

@Keeper, how many people targeted you last night? The fact that you forgot makes me think you may be lying about having that power.

@Celever, yeah, there's definitely some wolves on the Reinforce bandwagon, but none of them stand out to me in particular. Kecleon didn't vote for Reinforce, though. #JSYK. Camo and HW's deaths could've happened for any number of reasons, especially since the wolves/Porygon (not X) can easily use WIFOM.

@Cinesra, your accidental post technically contains a vote for Kecleon-X. Just letting you know in case you didn't want to do that.

Today, I would like a lynch on either Jeremy or Keeper. Since Camo flipped town, I think Jeremy is very likely to be scum (my case against Camo conflicted with my case against Jeremy), but my usual reasons for wanting Keeper lynched still stand today. I'm gonna vote for Jeremy now, but since yesterday ended with a no lynch, I really don't think we can afford to miss another lynch today, so I will change to Keeper if he's getting close to a lynch.

##SLICE'N'DICE: Jeremy1026 (I don't mind all that much if someone gets hammered today, because I really just want someone lynched today.)

 

[Keeper of Night]

RE: Werewolf XXI: The Members' Revolt. Day 3 ends May 29 at 11 AM CDT.

I didn't forget it, there was just no reason to bring it up. I already said I won't reveal who targets me, and for good reason. If you really must know, one person targeted me last night.