Finished Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Town Wins

Status
Not open for further replies.
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Celever said:
Camoclone said:
If I am town then they look at who I thought was town. If I am a wolf then look at who I thought was town.

These aren't opinions. They are facts.

OK, you don't make sense rn.
I make sense you just don't agree.

Personally I prefer no lynches D1 and it is how we play on a couple other sites,
The very very very good players on mafia sites hardly ever no-lynch d1. They only no lynch in special situations. This is not a special situation.

but I realize that the metagame for werewolf is different here so I tend not to give no lynch a real thought while playing here.
Why would the metagame matter at all? Every game we have this discussion so you have never really given it any thought? That surprises me.

However, alex has a point. No more posts after this
You can't tell anyone not to post after this. They can answer if they want to. If I were scum and I didn't know the answer to these questions they would simply post it in the scum chat (assuming a scum chat exists this game).

- what will I learn from your lynch?
This is a silly question. What my role is. What to think of my reads. What the next course of action is.

You have given no helpful opinions
Irrelevant.

and like alex said giving us your deceased role is neither helpful nor detrimental, unless there is a random cc flying around the town. On D1 this will not happen.
Ehh no. Of course it's helpful.

Don't forget, your opinion alone isn't good enough
Ummm ok. This is off topic.

We need to look at your posts and see if you actually had a case or feasible reason for suspecting the person, and so far you have neither.
What are you hinting at? I haven't even attacked someone yet.

This is why No Lynching is important on Day 1 to me.
I haven't seen solid logic yet. You haven't pushed for it in the past.

In fact, lynching is a little detrimental. It leads to a lot of speculation D2 and can often make the entire day a bit of a trainwreck,
Yeah my bad. We should never ever lynch. If lynching results in a train wreck when is it ever ok to lynch?

and after a lynch on D1 the wolves are in a perfect position to set up speculation with their kill.
You left out the fact that this applies both ways. The town can use lynch info too.

I'm not saying that a lynch Day 1 is always a bad thing - not at all - I am saying that No Lynch is so much more viable than people on this site give it credit for.
No lynch D1 is not that viable unless in extreme situations.

I stood up for No Lynch last game too, FYI, so this isn't off for my playstyle; just in case you mention it! :p
Ok...
Bolded...
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Meaty said:
Lenny said:
I'm not too fond of Wailord_2 for some reason. Just first reaction hunches.

I kind of agree with you there. Not that I have anything against Wailord_2, but as I've said many times before, voting no lynch is mainly beneficial to the wolves since they can freely pick off whoever they want at night anyway. Voting no lynch either makes you a wolf, or a pretty bad townie who doesn't realize that the only way to actually win is to get rid of the wolves, which is done almost entirely by lynching.

Yes, but information is necessary in order to lynch werewolves. We don't want another repeat of last game; we had 5 confotownies, including our seer and a mason pair, outed Day 1. This just gives the wolves freedom with their kill. The wolves can freely pick off whoever they want after Day 1 being a lynch, too. Just after a lynch they often have better options than witthout one. While the goal of the town is to lynch the wolves, every townie that dies gives the town less time to lynch the entire wolf group successfuly, which is what happens with a D1 lynch 90% of the time. This is also a 29-man game. Seriously, those are not good odds. I'd predict the wolf group to be about 6 members, with the indie group being maybe 3. Those are not good odds! ( a bit of a guess though).

Also, to the person who was asking earlier, TheGuy said to put ## in front of a question. So...
##TheGuy, is bolding our votes necessary?
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Camoclone you said literally nothing in that reply except taking things out of context and replying to things that weren't meant to have a response to.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Camoclone said:
Celever said:
OK, you don't make sense rn.
I make sense you just don't agree.

OK, you make sense literately. Your arguments, however, do not. Please provide reasoning, not statements and nothing else...

Personally I prefer no lynches D1 and it is how we play on a couple other sites,
The very very very good players on mafia sites hardly ever no-lynch d1. They only no lynch in special situations. This is not a special situation.

In an elite game no lynching is a poor decision, I agree - a no lynch in an expert rank game (of which I have participated in several) is an idiotic idea. In a regular game it is a feasible strategy. Please try and realize the difference.

but I realize that the metagame for werewolf is different here so I tend not to give no lynch a real thought while playing here.
Why would the metagame matter at all? Every game we have this discussion so you have never really given it any thought? That surprises me.

Because on some sites no lynching is a well-thought out option Day 1. On this site it is shot down immediately. I never give No Lynching a serious mention because of the aforementioned reason.

However, alex has a point. No more posts after this
You can't tell anyone not to post after this. They can answer if they want to. If I were scum and I didn't know the answer to these questions they would simply post it in the scum chat (assuming a scum chat exists this game).

OK please tell me you looked confused over this sarcastically? I was setting the scene for the example below ffs. If I didn't want people to post I wouldn't put it in a couple of words in a sentence, that whole statement was absolutely idiotic and it is a waste of my time to even reply to ot as on-depth as I have done.

- what will I learn from your lynch?
This is a silly question. What my role is. What to think of my reads. What the next course of action is.

OK, how do these help? Your reads on D1 are useless speculation. Not helpful. Your role being outed is not helpful. Tell me how it is helpful. The next course of action will not be dictated based on your flip. If it is this is an awful town.

You have given no helpful opinions
Irrelevant.

You have given no helpful opinions because it is impossible to do so on Day 1 99.99% of the time. Don't take it as a personal attack! >~>

and like alex said giving us your deceased role is neither helpful nor detrimental, unless there is a random cc flying around the town. On D1 this will not happen.
Ehh no. Of course it's helpful.

How is it bloody helpful!? Statements are useless and frivolous without evidence or basic reasoning to back them up. I say that your flipped role is useless; prove me wrong.

Don't forget, your opinion alone isn't good enough
Ummm ok. This is off topic.

It isn't good enough without a case. I wasn't talking about your opinion personally, I was using it plurally. I should have used "one" but whatever, you knew what I meant.

We need to look at your posts and see if you actually had a case or feasible reason for suspecting the person, and so far you have neither.
What are you hinting at? I haven't even attacked someone yet.

Because some time in this Day 1 you will build an awful case on one or more people, and they will then be a townie. I guarantee it, seriously,

This is why No Lynching is important on Day 1 to me.
I haven't seen solid logic yet. You haven't pushed for it in the past.

False. I even stated that I have pushed for it in the past. Last game, in fact! Back up your claims with evidence, PLEASE. This is also a full post of solid logic; please actually counter it.

In fact, lynching is a little detrimental. It leads to a lot of speculation D2 and can often make the entire day a bit of a trainwreck,
Yeah my bad. We should never ever lynch. If lynching results in a train wreck when is it ever ok to lynch?

You know what's annoying? When people troll others by taking wording literally, both online and IRL. This entire post is about lynching on Day 1. I shouldn't have to say "lynching on Day 1" every single time. For crying out loud please read the post as a post and not as a bunch of out of context sentences. You and I both know that that is an awful way to play Werewolf, or any online thing.

and after a lynch on D1 the wolves are in a perfect position to set up speculation with their kill.
You left out the fact that this applies both ways. The town can use lynch info too.

They cannot. I pointed this out in my post, for the rest of my answer to this read the last 2 sentences of the last reply I made. Together.

I'm not saying that a lynch Day 1 is always a bad thing - not at all - I am saying that No Lynch is so much more viable than people on this site give it credit for.
No lynch D1 is not that viable unless in extreme situations.

Sure, in expert games. In intermediate games? Not so much.

I stood up for No Lynch last game too, FYI, so this isn't off for my playstyle; just in case you mention it! :p
Ok...

Why would you not change your previous statement about me never mentioning it before once your read this sentence? I countered the argument before you even made it yet you still put it in your post. This is why it is hugely anti-village having you in this game, whether you're a member of the town or not.
Bolded...

Bolded again. Sorry, I started bolding, realized that you did it also but couldn't go back and change it realistically because of iPad.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

If you want a tl;dr look at alex's post lol.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

So does this argument happen Day 1 of every Werewolf game? :/

Celever, what exactly would be the difference between this and an expert game? Why is it a good option in one but not the other?
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Shampoo Thief said:
So does this argument happen Day 1 of every Werewolf game? :/

Yeah pretty much. At least on PB, and always camo. This isn't as bad as usual though, but I imagine its just getting started.

On topic, I personally disagree with NL, for reasons I and others have stated, but it wouldn't be completely awful at this point to NL.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Shampoo Thief said:
So does this argument happen Day 1 of every Werewolf game? :/

Yes.

##unvote: alex
##playingtheodds: TwistedTurtwig
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

alex said:
Camoclone you said literally nothing in that reply except taking things out of context and replying to things that weren't meant to have a response to.

I kinda actually agree on this, but that in particular, looking back at his previous games, isn't exactly abnormal for him.

Shampoo Thief said:
So does this argument happen Day 1 of every Werewolf game? :/

Yes. Yes it does.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Shampoo Thief said:
So does this argument happen Day 1 of every Werewolf game? :/

Celever, what exactly would be the difference between this and an expert game? Why is it a good option in one but not the other?

I've yet to play in an expert game with more than 15 players for one thing - basically they are always small. This already takes away the appeal of nling a lot, as it is a larger chance to find scum and it is easier to create connections with deaths with fewer players. Secondly, in games on Pokebeach I find some rookie mistakes happening quite commonly, such as mass sheeping (which can be a good thing in some OC games, but not so much in NOC) and taking any dead player's opinion as fact, which is one of the worst mistakes a player can make. A lot of rookie mistakes are either directly or indirectly influenced by a lynch or a death, which makes it is a less appealing option outside of expert games for me and I know a lot of other people who participate in such games.

Also yeah, it happens every time. Alex and I will start a revolution!

so fitting given the game's flavour! :3
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Current Vote Count:

Scorched Feathers 2 {Camoclone, Reinforce, Drohn}
Machamp the Champion 2 {Celever, Athena}
Reinforce 1 {TwistedTurtwig, Scorched Feathers}
TwistedTurtwig 2 {PMJ, Luispipe8}
Kecleon-X 1 {Porygon-X}
Porygon-X 1 {Kecleon-X}
alex 1 {grantm1999}
Drohn 1 {Chaos Jackal}
Celever 2 {Lenny, Machamp the Champion}

Lots of votes in random directions. My math is correct, don't question it, although I'm pretty sure I got everyone's vote please correct me if I put yours in the wrong place. And yes, you do not have to bold votes.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

##Hail: Drohn Phoenix King of The Fire Kingdoms and the rest of the land, formerly Fire Lord
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

This is incorrect. I never had my butt whooped, like the Phoenix King. I was successful! And kind.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Drohn is definitely scum. Whoever makes posts relevant to a finished game in a brand-new WW game is scum (or at least not quite helpful).

And please, no more of this damn argument. Lynch and No Lynch are both perfectly good strategies depending on the situation. The more the players, the more viable No Lynch is.

Normally, I don't agree with No Lynch, as lynching is the town's only real way of taking out scum. However, in this case, with 30 players and no real leads, chances of us lynching a wolf are actually even less than those available mathematically. Killing a townie won't give us much helpful info either, as it is way too early, and unless the townie is a seer we can't say anything for certain (and in this case, we'll have lost a seer). So

##Unsuspecttest: Drohn

##Sleep: No Lynch


Drohn is still unhealthy for the metagame though.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

^ Thank you for summing up my entire argument for a No Lynch this game! :)

##UNFLEX: Machamp The Champion
##NO: No Lynch
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Camoclone said:
Celever said:
OK, you don't make sense rn.
I make sense you just don't agree.

OK, you make sense literately. Your arguments, however, do not. Please provide reasoning, not statements and nothing else...

Yet again my arguments make sense you just don't agree. There is a difference between you understanding and agreeing.

Personally I prefer no lynches D1 and it is how we play on a couple other sites,
The very very very good players on mafia sites hardly ever no-lynch d1. They only no lynch in special situations. This is not a special situation.

In an elite game no lynching is a poor decision, I agree - a no lynch in an expert rank game (of which I have participated in several) is an idiotic idea. In a regular game it is a feasible strategy. Please try and realize the difference.

Why? Give me one good reason why no-lynching is bad in expert games but good in lower level games. More than anything it is better in lower level games because scum will slip more often.

but I realize that the metagame for werewolf is different here so I tend not to give no lynch a real thought while playing here.
Why would the metagame matter at all? Every game we have this discussion so you have never really given it any thought? That surprises me.

Because on some sites no lynching is a well-thought out option Day 1. On this site it is shot down immediately. I never give No Lynching a serious mention because of the aforementioned reason.

You are really starting to confuse me Celever. So let me get this straight. You didn't give no-lynch a real thought before because it is shot down immediately here; however, now you do. I don't get it, what changed?

However, alex has a point. No more posts after this
You can't tell anyone not to post after this. They can answer if they want to. If I were scum and I didn't know the answer to these questions they would simply post it in the scum chat (assuming a scum chat exists this game).

OK please tell me you looked confused over this sarcastically? I was setting the scene for the example below ffs. If I didn't want people to post I wouldn't put it in a couple of words in a sentence, that whole statement was absolutely idiotic and it is a waste of my time to even reply to ot as on-depth as I have done.

Isn't it also a waste of your time to type up that sentence and post it? The fact that you posted that sentence in the first place confuses me. What good does that sentence do?

- what will I learn from your lynch?
This is a silly question. What my role is. What to think of my reads. What the next course of action is.

OK, how do these help? Your reads on D1 are useless speculation. Not helpful. Your role being outed is not helpful. Tell me how it is helpful. The next course of action will not be dictated based on your flip. If it is this is an awful town.

They are not useless speculation though. Reads always matter. My role being outed is helpful. The next course of action very well might be decided based on how I flip. Night actions can we swayed a lot based off what I flip and what I thought of people.

You have given no helpful opinions
Irrelevant.

You have given no helpful opinions because it is impossible to do so on Day 1 99.99% of the time. Don't take it as a personal attack! >~>

Yet again this is completely irrelevant. And no... People do give helpful reads on D1. Every opinion is always helpful in some way.

and like alex said giving us your deceased role is neither helpful nor detrimental, unless there is a random cc flying around the town. On D1 this will not happen.
Ehh no. Of course it's helpful.

How is it bloody helpful!? Statements are useless and frivolous without evidence or basic reasoning to back them up. I say that your flipped role is useless; prove me wrong.

You can look at how I acted that day and base your further course of action upon it.


Don't forget, your opinion alone isn't good enough
Ummm ok. This is off topic.

It isn't good enough without a case. I wasn't talking about your opinion personally, I was using it plurally. I should have used "one" but whatever, you knew what I meant.

Why bring this up?

We need to look at your posts and see if you actually had a case or feasible reason for suspecting the person, and so far you have neither.
What are you hinting at? I haven't even attacked someone yet.

Because some time in this Day 1 you will build an awful case on one or more people, and they will then be a townie. I guarantee it, seriously,

And you mentioned this why?

This is why No Lynching is important on Day 1 to me.
I haven't seen solid logic yet. You haven't pushed for it in the past.

False. I even stated that I have pushed for it in the past. Last game, in fact! Back up your claims with evidence, PLEASE. This is also a full post of solid logic; please actually counter it.

How about no. I'm too lazy to look back at previous games. This doesn't matter to me one bit. Even if I did find something (which I probably would) it wouldn't be a scum tell this game.

In fact, lynching is a little detrimental. It leads to a lot of speculation D2 and can often make the entire day a bit of a trainwreck,
Yeah my bad. We should never ever lynch. If lynching results in a train wreck when is it ever ok to lynch?

You know what's annoying? When people troll others by taking wording literally, both online and IRL. This entire post is about lynching on Day 1. I shouldn't have to say "lynching on Day 1" every single time. For crying out loud please read the post as a post and not as a bunch of out of context sentences. You and I both know that that is an awful way to play Werewolf, or any online thing.

Answer the question. If lynching results in a train wreck when is it ever ok to lynch?

and after a lynch on D1 the wolves are in a perfect position to set up speculation with their kill.
You left out the fact that this applies both ways. The town can use lynch info too.

They cannot. I pointed this out in my post, for the rest of my answer to this read the last 2 sentences of the last reply I made. Together.

Yes they can. Good players always use reads to judge the next course of action regardless if it is D1 or D10.

I'm not saying that a lynch Day 1 is always a bad thing - not at all - I am saying that No Lynch is so much more viable than people on this site give it credit for.
No lynch D1 is not that viable unless in extreme situations.

Sure, in expert games. In intermediate games? Not so much.

What changes? More than anything it is better to lynch D1 in non-pro games simply because scum slips more.

I stood up for No Lynch last game too, FYI, so this isn't off for my playstyle; just in case you mention it! :p
Ok...

Why would you not change your previous statement about me never mentioning it before once your read this sentence? I countered the argument before you even made it yet you still put it in your post. This is why it is hugely anti-village having you in this game, whether you're a member of the town or not.

Pushed and mentioning are very different. You never pushed for it by any means in the past. Twisting my words won't get you any town creds. And you blow this out of proportion.

Bolded...


Bolded again. Sorry, I started bolding, realized that you did it also but couldn't go back and change it realistically because of iPad.

Italicized...

Celever said:
Shampoo Thief said:
So does this argument happen Day 1 of every Werewolf game? :/

Celever, what exactly would be the difference between this and an expert game? Why is it a good option in one but not the other?

I've yet to play in an expert game with more than 15 players for one thing - basically they are always small. This already takes away the appeal of nling a lot, as it is a larger chance to find scum and it is easier to create connections with deaths with fewer players. Secondly, in games on Pokebeach I find some rookie mistakes happening quite commonly, such as mass sheeping (which can be a good thing in some OC games, but not so much in NOC) and taking any dead player's opinion as fact, which is one of the worst mistakes a player can make. A lot of rookie mistakes are either directly or indirectly influenced by a lynch or a death, which makes it is a less appealing option outside of expert games for me and I know a lot of other people who participate in such games.

Also yeah, it happens every time. Alex and I will start a revolution!

so fitting given the game's flavour! :3
Ehhh no... Expert games feature players who have played for years on sites that are made for werewolf. Not only that but in a small game and a large game their is an almost equal chance of finding scum. For every 3 or 4 players there is generally a wolf. This does not change in larger games. As for rookie mistakes absolutely nothing you said has anything to do with no-lynching. Rookie mistakes won't stop after D1. In fact they might not even stop ever. If you are worried about rookie mistakes when is it ever ok to lynch?
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Also one more thing. No lynching is bad because quite simply it gives us one less chance to find scum.

And if you announce at the start of the day that you won't be lynching scum won't give you any leads at all. They will sit back and enjoy the no-lynch. At the end we will be left in worse shape than we were in before. We will have scum reads on town players.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

I'm not going to quote that post for clutter because I can only find one question to actually reply to, that being "when is it ever OK to lynch?"

The answer: When we have a legitimate read or target. In other words, every day besides Day 1 almost every game. By that, I mean almost every game we have legitimate reads adter Day 1, lynch or not.

One thing I would like to point out is when you said "twisting my words won't get you any town credit". I complained about you doing that (without explicitly stating it...) in that post. If we lynch anyone today I hope it is you, just because you have made multiple contradictions, and because I bought Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney recently that means you're guilty! >:L
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Camoclone said:
Also one more thing. No lynching is bad because quite simply it gives us one less chance to find scum.

And if you announce at the start of the day that you won't be lynching scum won't give you any leads at all. They will sit back and enjoy the no-lynch. At the end we will be left in worse shape than we were in before. We will have scum reads on town players.

We will always have scum reads on town players. Always. In a game of this size, we will until Day 7 or 8 probably.

Lynching a townie is worse because it essentially gives us two less chances to lynch scum.

We won't get any solid leads on anyone Day 1 90% of the time.
 
RE: Werewolf XXII: The Reign of Terror - Day 1 Ends August 2nd

Celever said:
I'm not going to quote that post for clutter because I can only find one question to actually reply to, that being "when is it ever OK to lynch?"

The answer: When we have a legitimate read or target. In other words, every day besides Day 1 almost every game. By that, I mean almost every game we have legitimate reads adter Day 1, lynch or not.

One thing I would like to point out is when you said "twisting my words won't get you any town credit". I complained about you doing that (without explicitly stating it...) in that post. If we lynch anyone today I hope it is you, just because you have made multiple contradictions, and because I bought Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney recently that means you're guilty! >:L
First of all I never twisted your words I responded to what you posted. Second of all you really should reply to my points if you care about a no-lynch. Third please point out my contradictions.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top