Future Metagame Speculation Thread
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RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Cofagrigus BDIF we already know that
Latias/Metwo/Altaria
Weavile/Exeggcute
Deoxys/Mewtwo/Attackers
Kingdra
Metagross
Latias/Metwo/Altaria
Weavile/Exeggcute
Deoxys/Mewtwo/Attackers
Kingdra
Metagross
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Top 5 cards:
Number 1: Ghetsis - I think this card will either be great or very bad. I'm betting on the second option. Why? Because it's easy to play around (if you expect your opponent to play Ghetsis, just play your trainers immediately), and you can benefit from it when your opponent uses it against you (like getting useless trainers off the hand so you can draw more with Bianca, or you don't want to discard certain trainers with Juniper).
Number 2: Tornadus EX - This card has soooo much potential. However, it's an EX with a crappy second attack that will just sit on your bench for the whole game, so it might not be very good.
Number 3: Mr. Mime - Yes, Mr. Mime. His ability is very good with all the Darkrai and Landorus EX sniping. It can win you the game easily. Don't underestimate this card as a tech.
Number 4: Super Energy Retrieval - Blastoise will absolutely love this card. I can't wait for it to come out.
Number 5: Frozen City - This card can be good. It just depends on Lugia, basically. If Lugia is good, this card is beast. If Lugia isn't worth it, this card won't be good.
Special mentions: Keckleon is the perfect Mewtwo counter for Blastoise (or any deck that uses DCE). It only gives up one prize! Mewtwo might see a decrease in play.
Electrode might find a place in Blastoise, because when those N's to 1/2 occur, those extra cards might win you the game.
I don't see Thundurus EX or Deoxys EX making any kind of impact in the game. Thundurus EX basically wastes you 1 turn of attacking to get back a Special Energy, while you get hit by your opponent. Deoxys EX just doesn't seem worth it.
The metagame won't change a lot after these sets come out IMO. It will basically be Darkrai VS Blastoise IMO. Of course that some other stuff will see play, but I don't think this set makes any big change to the metagame.
Top 5 cards:
Number 1: Ghetsis - I think this card will either be great or very bad. I'm betting on the second option. Why? Because it's easy to play around (if you expect your opponent to play Ghetsis, just play your trainers immediately), and you can benefit from it when your opponent uses it against you (like getting useless trainers off the hand so you can draw more with Bianca, or you don't want to discard certain trainers with Juniper).
Number 2: Tornadus EX - This card has soooo much potential. However, it's an EX with a crappy second attack that will just sit on your bench for the whole game, so it might not be very good.
Number 3: Mr. Mime - Yes, Mr. Mime. His ability is very good with all the Darkrai and Landorus EX sniping. It can win you the game easily. Don't underestimate this card as a tech.
Number 4: Super Energy Retrieval - Blastoise will absolutely love this card. I can't wait for it to come out.
Number 5: Frozen City - This card can be good. It just depends on Lugia, basically. If Lugia is good, this card is beast. If Lugia isn't worth it, this card won't be good.
Special mentions: Keckleon is the perfect Mewtwo counter for Blastoise (or any deck that uses DCE). It only gives up one prize! Mewtwo might see a decrease in play.
Electrode might find a place in Blastoise, because when those N's to 1/2 occur, those extra cards might win you the game.
I don't see Thundurus EX or Deoxys EX making any kind of impact in the game. Thundurus EX basically wastes you 1 turn of attacking to get back a Special Energy, while you get hit by your opponent. Deoxys EX just doesn't seem worth it.
The metagame won't change a lot after these sets come out IMO. It will basically be Darkrai VS Blastoise IMO. Of course that some other stuff will see play, but I don't think this set makes any big change to the metagame.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Donphan (Plasma Gale)/Sigilyph/Latias/Skyarrow Bridge/Max Potion: 40 Damage and then switch to whatever you need to stall. Max Potion will let you keep Donphan alive and run out your opponents catchers.
Beedrill/Ninetales/Max Potion/Hypno-
oison Beam/Virbank Gym:Speedrill will net you some quick KO's and whatever you fail to KO gets knocked out the next turn by Ninetales. Keldeo won't do well to avoid the special conditions because it gets OHKO'd by Beedrill.
Ditto/Eveeloutions/Weavile/Exeggutor/Sableye: Toolbox deck, surprise Stage 1's with DItto, Weavile for heavy damage, Exeggcute for extra Weavile damage/Ultra Ball/Compy Search stuffs, Exeggutor for surprise Supporter Lock, Umbereon gives Weavile and other Eevee's extra HP, Espeon can snipe Deoxy's/Mewtwo 80 for 1, Flareon has some late-game potential, Vaporeon KO's Landorous with a Plus Power (or Deoxys EX), and Jolteon/Glaceon are possible inclusions as well. Sableye to get back trainers if needed.
Other notable deck ideas that I like are Kingdra/Electrode and Dragonite Lock. Although I don't know how either would actually perform.
Honestly the good Pokemon to come from the set are:
Exeggcute (Kinda Exeggutor)*
Glaceon*
Mr. Mime (although he isn't that good)
Espeon*
Deoxys EX
Weavile*
Absol*
Kingdra
Raticate*
Beedrill
Flareon*
Vaporeon*
Cryognal
Kyurem
Electrode*
Thundurus EX*
Metagross
Umbreon*
Dragonite
Latias
Tornadus EX
Everything with a * next to it is either weak to Landorus EX, or has a basic that would be OHKO'd by Landorus. Only 10/21 of those cards are safe from Landorus, and even that is a stretch as Dragonite, Kindgra, Beedrill, and Metagross all have basics that are vulnerable to a T1 Landorus. So I would say that the BDIF for this metagame would be a deck that can incorporate Landorus EX, while not having it as the focus of the deck.
Donphan (Plasma Gale)/Sigilyph/Latias/Skyarrow Bridge/Max Potion: 40 Damage and then switch to whatever you need to stall. Max Potion will let you keep Donphan alive and run out your opponents catchers.
Beedrill/Ninetales/Max Potion/Hypno-
oison Beam/Virbank Gym:Speedrill will net you some quick KO's and whatever you fail to KO gets knocked out the next turn by Ninetales. Keldeo won't do well to avoid the special conditions because it gets OHKO'd by Beedrill.Ditto/Eveeloutions/Weavile/Exeggutor/Sableye: Toolbox deck, surprise Stage 1's with DItto, Weavile for heavy damage, Exeggcute for extra Weavile damage/Ultra Ball/Compy Search stuffs, Exeggutor for surprise Supporter Lock, Umbereon gives Weavile and other Eevee's extra HP, Espeon can snipe Deoxy's/Mewtwo 80 for 1, Flareon has some late-game potential, Vaporeon KO's Landorous with a Plus Power (or Deoxys EX), and Jolteon/Glaceon are possible inclusions as well. Sableye to get back trainers if needed.
Other notable deck ideas that I like are Kingdra/Electrode and Dragonite Lock. Although I don't know how either would actually perform.
Honestly the good Pokemon to come from the set are:
Exeggcute (Kinda Exeggutor)*
Glaceon*
Mr. Mime (although he isn't that good)
Espeon*
Deoxys EX
Weavile*
Absol*
Kingdra
Raticate*
Beedrill
Flareon*
Vaporeon*
Cryognal
Kyurem
Electrode*
Thundurus EX*
Metagross
Umbreon*
Dragonite
Latias
Tornadus EX
Everything with a * next to it is either weak to Landorus EX, or has a basic that would be OHKO'd by Landorus. Only 10/21 of those cards are safe from Landorus, and even that is a stretch as Dragonite, Kindgra, Beedrill, and Metagross all have basics that are vulnerable to a T1 Landorus. So I would say that the BDIF for this metagame would be a deck that can incorporate Landorus EX, while not having it as the focus of the deck.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Do you think that the second plasma oriented set will change the meta? I hear that it has a tech that should make Lugia EX a lot more playable. That's just what I heard though. Thanks!Roronoa Zoro said:
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
How about Rayeels with Lugia EX. Rayquaza can take prizes off of big EXs, Lugia can take prizes off of everything else, Zekrom can be teched in againt Sigilyph and you can be taking 2 prizes off of everything.
How about Rayeels with Lugia EX. Rayquaza can take prizes off of big EXs, Lugia can take prizes off of everything else, Zekrom can be teched in againt Sigilyph and you can be taking 2 prizes off of everything.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
The only good cards in this set are IMO (not including shinies):
Chandulure
IF we get a collector type thing deoxys EX
Tornadus EX (its gonna be like a $60 card )
super energy retrieval
ghetsis
frozen city
plasma energy (duh)
metagorss
plasma poke ball
float stone (AMAZING in garbodor)
latias EX will not be played very often, but it will make a slight impact on the format, because you need to play pokemon without abilities or lose
I dont know how I feel about life essence. If tool scrapper stops getting played often/is rotated before life essence it will be amazing
The only good cards in this set are IMO (not including shinies):
Chandulure
IF we get a collector type thing deoxys EX
Tornadus EX (its gonna be like a $60 card
)super energy retrieval
ghetsis
frozen city
plasma energy (duh)
metagorss
plasma poke ball
float stone (AMAZING in garbodor)
latias EX will not be played very often, but it will make a slight impact on the format, because you need to play pokemon without abilities or lose
I dont know how I feel about life essence. If tool scrapper stops getting played often/is rotated before life essence it will be amazing
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Moving to the appropriate forum.
Moving to the appropriate forum.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
It's like pokemon is TRYING to make garbodor more viable with float stone and Elesa. I guess they want a stronger anti meta deck...
And catcher stall will no longer exist with keldeo EX+ float tone, making you need a catcher and a tool scrapper to stall, in this set eels will get a LOT more powerful with no catcher stall, just have a keldeo EX with float stone sitting on your bench.
It's like pokemon is TRYING to make garbodor more viable with float stone and Elesa. I guess they want a stronger anti meta deck...
And catcher stall will no longer exist with keldeo EX+ float tone, making you need a catcher and a tool scrapper to stall, in this set eels will get a LOT more powerful with no catcher stall, just have a keldeo EX with float stone sitting on your bench.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Okay, that's a problem. I still think this needs eels to power it up. At least without rayquaza, you can get away with just plasma and lightning energy.
I see poison hypnotic beam/virbank city gym become a big deck. Both cards combo with a lot of stuff.
I also think Chandelure will help make fire viable again. Chandy can get energy from the deck while Entei EX can recover from the discard pile. There's also darmanitan who can benefit from the 10 damage to itself (I doubt it will be a huge deck, but it can be fun to try out).
Soul Seeker said:
Okay, that's a problem. I still think this needs eels to power it up. At least without rayquaza, you can get away with just plasma and lightning energy.
I see poison hypnotic beam/virbank city gym become a big deck. Both cards combo with a lot of stuff.
I also think Chandelure will help make fire viable again. Chandy can get energy from the deck while Entei EX can recover from the discard pile. There's also darmanitan who can benefit from the 10 damage to itself (I doubt it will be a huge deck, but it can be fun to try out).
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
What QWERTY DITTO said, and fire still doesn't have any really good attackers. Reshiram doesn't count because if you're using Chandelure as your accelerator you'll have no real way to accelerate the energy back from the discard (technically I can attack with Reshiram, energy retrieval and attach, switch to Entei, attack, switch back to Reshiram and attack again every other turn but that's way too resource intensive to maintain). Chandelure wouldn't really improve a quad Entei deck (make it less consistent for the chance at a turn 2 90?), and quad Entei has always been pretty bad, especially now.
What QWERTY DITTO said, and fire still doesn't have any really good attackers. Reshiram doesn't count because if you're using Chandelure as your accelerator you'll have no real way to accelerate the energy back from the discard (technically I can attack with Reshiram, energy retrieval and attach, switch to Entei, attack, switch back to Reshiram and attack again every other turn but that's way too resource intensive to maintain). Chandelure wouldn't really improve a quad Entei deck (make it less consistent for the chance at a turn 2 90?), and quad Entei has always been pretty bad, especially now.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Or u could use super rod.
Still sucks though.
Dark Void said:
Or u could use super rod.
Still sucks though.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Deoxys EX/Thundurus EX/Kyurem (Plasma)
Thundurus EX/Lugia EX/Tornadus EX (Plasma)
Deoxys EX/Thundurus EX/Tornadus EX (Plasma)
Depending on the deck used, the energy used will be Plasma energy, Prism energy, WLFM Blend, Lightning and DCE.
Essentially, these decks rip apart BW8 format.
Thundurus EX hits for 30 first turn and can accelerate energy. Together with Hypotoxin and Virbank that's 60. Add a Deoxys or two (they act as plus powers to other plasma pokemon) and you have donking potential there. byebye squirtles
Kyurem hits 30 active/30 benched with [W][C]. This spreads damage around to set up 1 hit kills with its next attack...
[W][W][C] 120 damage. Cannot use this atttack next turn. 3 Deoxys + Hypotoxin + 120 = 180 = 2 prizes.
Lugia we all know and love.
Tornadus EX can do 60+ 30x plasma energy. 150 damage with just 3 plasma energy attached. Add in some Deoxys EX or Hypotoxin, OHKO EX. The other attack allows you to shuffle your hand into your deck and draw 6 cards. Good for consistency.
Colress Machine allows for instant energy acceleration. I've seen Tornadus decks do turn 1 120 damage.
Scramble Switch is a very flexible card that repositions your energy instantly. Must have.
Even though the whole deck is Plasma, Ultra ball is used as well as Plasma Ball to throw energy (even special) into the discard. Then Thundurus EX can reattach it to another Pokemon with its attack.
These are the main observations of the Japanese metagame revolving around Plasma Pokemon.
Deoxys EX/Thundurus EX/Kyurem (Plasma)
Thundurus EX/Lugia EX/Tornadus EX (Plasma)
Deoxys EX/Thundurus EX/Tornadus EX (Plasma)
Depending on the deck used, the energy used will be Plasma energy, Prism energy, WLFM Blend, Lightning and DCE.
Essentially, these decks rip apart BW8 format.
Thundurus EX hits for 30 first turn and can accelerate energy. Together with Hypotoxin and Virbank that's 60. Add a Deoxys or two (they act as plus powers to other plasma pokemon) and you have donking potential there. byebye squirtles
Kyurem hits 30 active/30 benched with [W][C]. This spreads damage around to set up 1 hit kills with its next attack...
[W][W][C] 120 damage. Cannot use this atttack next turn. 3 Deoxys + Hypotoxin + 120 = 180 = 2 prizes.
Lugia we all know and love.
Tornadus EX can do 60+ 30x plasma energy. 150 damage with just 3 plasma energy attached. Add in some Deoxys EX or Hypotoxin, OHKO EX. The other attack allows you to shuffle your hand into your deck and draw 6 cards. Good for consistency.
Colress Machine allows for instant energy acceleration. I've seen Tornadus decks do turn 1 120 damage.
Scramble Switch is a very flexible card that repositions your energy instantly. Must have.
Even though the whole deck is Plasma, Ultra ball is used as well as Plasma Ball to throw energy (even special) into the discard. Then Thundurus EX can reattach it to another Pokemon with its attack.
These are the main observations of the Japanese metagame revolving around Plasma Pokemon.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Try to get 3 Deoxys and 3 Plasma Energy on a Pokemon. It is not easy to get 3 Deoxys running quickly even if you run 4 Deoxys and heavy search. No one is going to let you have 3 Plasma Energy on a Pokemon. Enhanced Hammer says hi. There are going to be lots of stadium which won't let Virbank enter a lot. Also there would be almost no space there. 4 Colress Machine, 4 Plasma Energy, 4 Prism/WLFM, 4 Deoxys, 2 Virbank, 3 Hypnotic Laser, 3 Thundurus EX, 2 Tornadus EX, 4 Catcher, etc. You won't have that much of space.
Try to get 3 Deoxys and 3 Plasma Energy on a Pokemon. It is not easy to get 3 Deoxys running quickly even if you run 4 Deoxys and heavy search. No one is going to let you have 3 Plasma Energy on a Pokemon. Enhanced Hammer says hi. There are going to be lots of stadium which won't let Virbank enter a lot. Also there would be almost no space there. 4 Colress Machine, 4 Plasma Energy, 4 Prism/WLFM, 4 Deoxys, 2 Virbank, 3 Hypnotic Laser, 3 Thundurus EX, 2 Tornadus EX, 4 Catcher, etc. You won't have that much of space.
RE: The Official Future Metagame Speculation Thread
Meta for Pokemon? Doesn't matter if it's current or future.
Basic EXs. Basic EXs everywhere.
Meta for Pokemon? Doesn't matter if it's current or future.
Basic EXs. Basic EXs everywhere.