Pidgeot EX is like a dollar.
Discussion The New "Safeguard" Abilities are Broken...
- Thread starter crystal_pidgeot
- Start date
Pidgeot EX is like a dollar.
So far Expanded isn't the main format Pokemon is played with and as a result I happen to think that 1. it will not be an issue there either and 2. again I only see it opening up more viability to non-EX/GX based decks, many of which should excist in Expanded anyway.
GX or EX arn't broken, neither is Safeguard or Alolan Ninetales. With a single attack that deals 80 damage not only do you have a guaranteed 2 turns to figure out an awnser against it, it still also can be Ko'd by other stage 1 Pokemon quite easily.
So far there is very little reason to play Machamp GX because it does not have the same set up potential as other decks. Again the power of Alolan Ninetales is only there because Alolan Vulpix' Beacon allows for it to be consistantly searched for.
Again there is enough reason for A. Ninetales to interact with EX aswell, because EX are part of both the Standard and Expanded format. This is the whole reason as to why the wording on Safeguard is what it is on A. Ninetales and Hoopa. There is 0 reason to errata it, change it, ban it or whatever. We're talking about an evolution card with 110HP and a typical poor attack. You can dislike Safeguard, all it really does is keep GX and EX in check and this is actually a good thing.
I did, I guess you might be very new to the game. T
They arn't broken and effectively part of the game since 2003, they dissapeared and reappeared throughout the years and while they have been setting a competitive standard for Pokemon they have never been exclusive to one particular deck or archtype. What strong cards lead to if available to all is an interesting game that is quick to play also. Because of the way Alolan Vulpix is designed, all decks can technically run Alolan Ninetales also, if your just interested in the Power.
Since the discussion is posted on the competitive play part of the forums I would also expect you to understand what this actually means.
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Ex and gx are so broken they all have a rule saying they take up 2 prizes. These new ex and gx basic pokemon have 190 hp when most stage 2 non ex/gx have 170 hp. Stage 2 gx have 250 hp with ridicules effects and attacks that are so broken they can only be used once per game. Back in s/p era I ran the take out machamp. He wasn't the most expensive card but at least he dealt with broken sp pokemon. Now these pokemon are so big it's pointless to even compete without them. Siesmatoad could lock up the board for a double colorless energy. I could go on and on about how broken ex/gx pokemon are all day.
You're the one who said it was broken.
Yeah, I know. This is why worry about Expanded because they are making cards that reference that format. Sure, Pokemon-EX are in the format and will be for another year or so but there won't be anymore printed Pokemon-EX for Standard so they shouldn't have referenced them in the Sun and Moon block and just let them rotate without hurting other cards in the Expanded format.
It's your favorite Pokemon! That should be reason enough. It's reason enough for me to play with Pidgeot-EX.
I'm not seeing it from a game balance standpoint. Since Expanded is an official sanctioned format, they have to better design all cards forward with it in mind without unbalancing the format. This new Safeguard Ability makes all the Expanded Safeguard mons (and even the Carbink from Fates) worthless since the new Pokemon, one of which is a basic that can block both EX and GX mons while being a bigger body.
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So this has been a very long post, but what it boils down to is this:
If you run Alolan Vulpix, you should run a copy of baby Ninetales because there will be some games where it will give you an autowin.
Unless you don't want to win that way.
And if you run a deck with all EX or GX attackers, just know that every once in awhile, you're going to come across a Ninetales and it's going to be an autoloss - and that's not necessarily a horrible, terrible thing - sometimes you take some chances.
And if half the decks in the meta start running baby Ninetales, then we'll all start diversifying our decks.
If you run Alolan Vulpix, you should run a copy of baby Ninetales because there will be some games where it will give you an autowin.
Unless you don't want to win that way.
And if you run a deck with all EX or GX attackers, just know that every once in awhile, you're going to come across a Ninetales and it's going to be an autoloss - and that's not necessarily a horrible, terrible thing - sometimes you take some chances.
And if half the decks in the meta start running baby Ninetales, then we'll all start diversifying our decks.
I'm sure in the next few sets we'll get some anti-ability supporter/item cards that will give pure EX/GX builds a way to deal with this. Until then just plan on teching something to deal with it. A lot of the good GX lists already have secondary attackers that can deal with it, Bulu has Vikavolt, Garde has Gallade, Metagross can just use a Metang due to weakness, ect.
As for EX, EX decks are basically dead anyways. Garbodor killed the remaining mega decks and tool removal+choice band basically kills all EX basic decks. Volcanion is the last one standing and it runs non-EX/GX attackers anyways.
As for EX, EX decks are basically dead anyways. Garbodor killed the remaining mega decks and tool removal+choice band basically kills all EX basic decks. Volcanion is the last one standing and it runs non-EX/GX attackers anyways.
I have deleted a handful of posts here that were off topic as well as some inappropriate context. Please keep all posts relevant to the topic at hand and accepted for a PG-13 environment.
I'm talking about maintaining the health of Expanded, where Pokemon-EX are, as well as the Safeguard Ability. The question is why does a Pokemon in Sun and Moon need to have immunity to Pokemon-EX. I'm confused as to how Garbodor killed mega deck though? There are also decent Pokemon-EX going into rotation as well as megas that work.
Sun and Moon cards need to acknowledge Pokemon-EX because they co-exist in the same formats. Sure, more Pokemon-EX aren't going to be printed, but they're still relevant to Standard and Expanded. I bet older cards that refer only to Pokemon-EX would refer to both EX & GX when they were printed if Pokemon-GX existed at the time. Honestly, I wish a ruling was issued that any reference to Pokemon-EX applied to Pokemon-GX so cards like Brigette could only search out 1 or Suicune was protected against Pokemon-GX to better balance them in relation to newer cards. Or at least an errata on certain cards to that affect if not all of them.
I've definitely skipped a lot of these posts, since many seem to just be bashing and not actual discussion, but I'm gonna throw in my two cents.
When EX cards were the norm, TPC didn't know they would be printing GX card until much later into the XY life cycle, so BW and most of XY have these abilities that just target EX. You can't really future-proof stuff like this. Now that we have both GX and EX in standard, you have to cover both. On top of that, it covers the whole field and gives you options to play in expanded with these new replacement cards. First off, it stops people from having to target only a specific type of card while leaving their matchup vs the other as a loss, it's bad for balance. Secondly, it helps to push sales having these new cards that cover additional matchups.
Thinking about it, however, they could potentially future-proof all safeguard abilities by just creating a wording that would imply that they are protected from all 2-prize attackers.
When EX cards were the norm, TPC didn't know they would be printing GX card until much later into the XY life cycle, so BW and most of XY have these abilities that just target EX. You can't really future-proof stuff like this. Now that we have both GX and EX in standard, you have to cover both. On top of that, it covers the whole field and gives you options to play in expanded with these new replacement cards. First off, it stops people from having to target only a specific type of card while leaving their matchup vs the other as a loss, it's bad for balance. Secondly, it helps to push sales having these new cards that cover additional matchups.
Thinking about it, however, they could potentially future-proof all safeguard abilities by just creating a wording that would imply that they are protected from all 2-prize attackers.
That sounds like a good thing to me. If you don't have diversity in a game, people start getting bored playing or playing against the same type of decks over and over, and that's how people start to leave the game.
Here is a point I haven't seen yet; Alolan Ninetales is suited for new/young players.
My reasoning:
Despair Ray is the kind of deck that makes it very hard to tech in a non-EX/GX attacker. I've been wrecked by Carbink BREAK when my Hex was prized.
My reasoning:
- Young players can't afford many EX/GX cards (or their parents just get them those bad promo boxes)
- Alolan Ninetales is accessible as part of a theme deck (a half-decent one, I might add).
- Luminous Barrier keeps the deck somewhat competitive with EX/GX decks. Nothing is more demoralizing than getting ROFLstomped at your first tournament. I see lots of young players come and go at League because of this. It also dispels the myth that $$$=better.
- There is a GX that is compatible with the theme deck.
- In addition to the ability, it hits one of the best decks at the moment (Volcanion/Turtonator) for weakness, while not being weak to another popular type (Grass).
- Young players that start to get into the game more will "discover" the better Alolan Vulpix with Beacon (younger players LOVE figuring out ways to improve their deck).
Despair Ray is the kind of deck that makes it very hard to tech in a non-EX/GX attacker. I've been wrecked by Carbink BREAK when my Hex was prized.
as other people have already mentioned, most if not all meta decks have readily available answers such as baby volcanion with steam up, metang hitting for weakness, vikavolt and tapu koko second attack. gardevoir might have a difficult time but I'm sure they have an answer I can't think of. its worth testing as a 1 of but I don't expect it to be meta changing at all. should not see play in most top decks at bigger tournaments
I don't think it's OP but I can see how in multiple decks have a hard time countering it. My favourite counters are Bisharp STS and Oranguru SUM but Oranguru is only really good in decks with DCE or max elixer but Bisharp is more versatile but takes up alot more deck space as a 2-2 line is much more than a singular Oranguru. But than there's the argument that you can use a 1-1 line but than there's the risk of being walled because of prize inconsistency.
Gallade BKT
Although those non-gx metagross are rotating (ancient origins), even leaving a metang unevolved with 3 energy will 1 shot a baby ninetales with metal weakness (80x2)
You just have to notice the matchup and try to leave one unevolved