The Mewtwo EX/Eelektrik/Zekrom Discussion Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
It's a lot more work to set up two Eelektriks, get two energy in the discard pile, and often use a Switch than it is to get out Mewtwo and DCE.

Usually in the early-game, they're so focused on setting up other stuff that they can't pull off the Mewtwo+DCE drop, and if they do, it leaves their field weak and open for you to come back. I used to think the same thing about using X-Ball early game, but after trying it out myself, it's not as risky of a strategy as it first appears to be. I actually ended up dropping Thundurus completely because it was so inferior to Mewtwo.
 
I only run one Thundurus, but I end up starting Tynamo most of the time. (The free Retreat one.) If I have Collector in my hand, I choose how I want to start. If I have zero Energy, I just search out the Thundurus. If I'm jacked, I bring up the Zekrom. I like to start early with Zekrom simply because he gets the Energy in the Discard Pile quickly. I like to save Mewtwo EX for later because Zekrom has 10 more HP, which can actually make or break you. Plus, I wreck opposing Tornadus's or at least get some damage on other Mewtwo EXs, so it's just a DCE drop or a couple Dynamotors away from a KO.
 
Celebi23 said:
It's a lot more work to set up two Eelektriks, get two energy in the discard pile, and often use a Switch than it is to get out Mewtwo and DCE.

Usually in the early-game, they're so focused on setting up other stuff that they can't pull off the Mewtwo+DCE drop, and if they do, it leaves their field weak and open for you to come back. I used to think the same thing about using X-Ball early game, but after trying it out myself, it's not as risky of a strategy as it first appears to be. I actually ended up dropping Thundurus completely because it was so inferior to Mewtwo.
Click to expand...

Juniper, Sage and JA don't make it very difficult in my testing at all. Also Mewtwo can very easily be searched out (collector, dual ball, etc) and since almost everything else is a basic in the meta now you can go on and continue to set up with that as your supporter for the turn. Plus, you don't need a DCE necessarily with all the energy acceleration in the format. I guess it really just depends on your opponents deck, but I know that I can personally get out Mewtwo and power it up 9/10 times whenever I want it, so I assume my opponent can as well. When I use Mewtwo myself, it just supports this most of the time.

Also, I don't think Thundurus is great, don't misunderstand me. I, like Serperior, only run 1, as it's a decent alternate attacker, a pretty great/self-sufficient starter, helps get energy out early game, gets some nice catcher KOs and has free retreat with Skyarrow, BUT it is outclassed as a flat out attacker by most of the rest of the deck 80-90% of the time and it is fairly frail so it isn't worth a heavy line.

It's just nice to be able to have a free retreater out in any Eel deck, and Thundurus lets you do that without losing a bench spot to a baby or tynamo while still being a viable attacker. He isn't my ideal early game attacker, but I can do ok with it.
 
Thundurus has one retreat.

I'd be happy to test this theory with you sometime. I've played plenty of games with this deck, and attacking early-game with Mewtwo wins me far more games than it loses.

I have a friend who cut Tornadus from his CTM, using the same logic. It's far more effective than the standard CTM.

I think you might be underestimating how much setup most decks need in the first two or three turns. Most decks are reliant on setting up a lot of cards very quickly. Going for Mewtwo on top of that is overwhelming, especially when you need a DCE. If you don't have the DCE, you'd have to shuffle-draw over Collector T1/2. That can screw your setup.
 
Celebi23 said:
Thundurus has one retreat.

I'd be happy to test this theory with you sometime. I've played plenty of games with this deck, and attacking early-game with Mewtwo wins me far more games than it loses.

I have a friend who cut Tornadus from his CTM, using the same logic. It's far more effective than the standard CTM.

I think you might be underestimating how much setup most decks need in the first two or three turns. Most decks are reliant on setting up a lot of cards very quickly. Going for Mewtwo on top of that is overwhelming, especially when you need a DCE. If you don't have the DCE, you'd have to shuffle-draw over Collector T1/2. That can screw your setup.
Click to expand...
Wait, so Tornadus isn't good in CTM?

IMO, Zekeels is just an inferior version to Magneel. That may just be me though.
 
I still kind of like Tornadus in CTM, but I tend to favor cutting it for extra space. The original Shaymin/Mewtwo/Celebi deck didn't use Tornadus.

I feel like Magneel is an inferior Zekeel. With Zekrom-EX hitting 150 and Mewtwo hitting anything you want, Magnezone is just like a clunkier, more space-consuming version of these cards. It obviously offers some advantages (OHKOing any EX, built-in draw, only gives up one prize), but it brings far more disadvantages. It's much harder to spam Tynamos early-game when you're also trying to spam Magnemites. ZekEel just seems like the best version of Eelektrik at this point.
 
I'll test your theory Celebi. When I drop a Mewtwo EX T1 with a DCE, I either get Lost Removed or revenge-Mewtwo'd and I'm in deeper trouble. Or maybe I just get bad luck. :p Either way...what? No Tornadus in MTC? MC? Lol.
 
MiCS.

It's nearly impossible for them to T1 revenge your DCE'd Mewtwo unless it's Celebi/Mewtwo. Most decks aren't running PlusPower anymore, so it would only do 160.

Also, it's just my theory. Note how the list in the OP is pretty based around a fast Mewtwo.
 
Celebi23 said:
Thundurus has one retreat.
Click to expand...

Captain Oats said:
and has free retreat with Skyarrow
Click to expand...
^
Serperior said:
I'll test your theory Celebi. When I drop a Mewtwo EX T1 with a DCE, I either get Lost Removed or revenge-Mewtwo'd and I'm in deeper trouble. Or maybe I just get bad luck. :p Either way...what? No Tornadus in MTC? MC? Lol.
Click to expand...

This is what normally happens to me. It's just a huge liability if your opponent has a consistent list and runs Mewtwo, the Mewtwo prize exchange is just a horrible thing to deal with unless you are on the better end of it, and some decks do still run PP.

I don't doubt that it can be effective, but past T1 Mewtwos are getting dropped and revenge KOing yours because acceleration is normally set up at this point so I can't see how you can focus on that as your only early game attacker, and going second really hurts Mewtwos effectiveness. And 40 damage isn't KOing much besides Tynamo or a baby. You are arguing it's heavy disruption, but I just don't see it.
 
justintam0731 said:
I suggest that put Tornadus in because it is a good Terrakion counter
Click to expand...

You 2HKO Terrakion. Terrakion 2HKOs you. Its not really a very good counter, if one could call it that.
 
It depends on your list and playstyle. Some people only like to use Zek EX when they need to ohko something like a benched emboar, typhlosion, terrakion, etc that your other attackers can't ko. Some like to go heavy agro with it and deal out 150 close to every to every other turn. Anywhere from 1-3 is ok imo, but 3 can be hugely risky if you aren't careful. Skeleton attacker list is normally a 2-2-2 split between zek ex/bw and mewtwo. Personal playstyle really affects this more than anything though.
 
Thanks for the in dept describtion of the deck. I'm new at this kind of deck. I knew the superior, but really needed the in dept. Thank you :D I just have a few questions: 1. Would you normally want to have three Eelektrik's on your bench, or is two the preferable amount? 2. Would it be an idea to have the normal Zekrom active, while you set up the EXs, since it only gives one prize?
 
I set up two Eels and I'm ok. I go 3/1 with my EX/BW Zek because I like to be able to attach DCE to it and not waste turns digging out two more Lightning Energy for Bolt Strike afterwards. I rarely use my BW Zek. Saying this, use Zek EX and go for the big 150. The Truth can't keep up with this kind of damage output, and you throw Energy in the Discard Pile to be recycled.
 
3 eels takes up too much room on the bench. 2 is just fine, although normally 1 more benched tynamo can be helpful. There are lots of different ways to play the deck, you choose your attacker based on the matchup more than what you want though. Against the truth, yeah use Zekrom EX and Mewtwo EX, but if you are playing the mirror use Zekrom BW and EX if you need it. Against MTC run Zekrom BW and Mewtwo to counter theirs, or the REV/6 Corners run almost straight Zekrom EX. You have a pretty good answer against everything, you just have to be judicial about when it's time to use which attacker, which comes mostly with playing experience.

Generally, if you don't know what to do, Zekrom BW is a good attacker for early game; it's efficient, cost effective, easy to get out and can get quite a few KOs on most things. Zekrom EX's 150 normally isn't necessary early game and just ends up being too much overkill to be worth it.
 
@Serperior
Yeah it was pretty cool when I found out that you could just discard the DCE, and then attach another :)

@Captain Oats
That's exactly what I thought (that 3 Eels would fill too much).
Thanks for the match-up advice. I'll remember those :) I think the playing experience is about to be the only thing I'm missing :D

Theres another thing I came to think of: Is Mewtwo EX a card that you must be careful about playing? I can imagine that an opp easely can OHKO it with another Mewtwo EX. However Zekrom EX is much safer since it's pretty hard to OHKO, right?
 
The Mewtwo prize exchange is mostly in favor of this deck, 80%+ of the time I would say. No matter what deck you are playing you have to be careful about when you drop it, but ZekEels seems to be able to have more flexibility. Zek EX can be return KO'd by terrakion, which can be powered up the turn it's dropped with eels/celebi/emboar so it can be equally as risky. You just have to know what you are playing and know what to look for. If you see fighting or prism (in most decks) expect the terrakion tech. An eviolite will save your Zekrom EX from a revenge ko unless they run PP.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top