Finished Mafia XLII: War of the Gods ~ GAME OVER ~ Town wins!

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Celever said:
You didn't comment on post #415. That's the most important thing today so far.
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I mean. What am i really supposed to say. You have a valid point on BB. I do agree that he does some shady stuff. (I guess commented on that before with me calling out that that "placeholder vote" is incredibly unuseful.
 
Celever said:
OK cool, but is the scumslip not solid enough to actually have you vote for him?
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You got a point there. I was about to hold my vote back.
BUT
he didn't say anything about that case yet.

So mirdo's Wingull used pressure!
##Vote:bbninjas
 
mordacazir said:
That is what I said yesterday. (In game days)
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I also said that my reads were similar to yours yesterday.

Celever said:
This is getting ridiculous. This entire situation. You have no idea how much I want to swear right now -- everything here beggars belief. Everything by NP and bb, anyway. mord and rainy's posts are fine.
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Ditto, except not me and NP.

So WHY would you vote for a vocal player? Legit -- you, while not thinking scattered is scum, have voted for scattered. And when given the opportunity to backpedal this, you refused. I'm so completely confused by this action. OK, you put down a placeholder vote (which is a dumb concept anyway). Why on earth would you not target one of the people who think is scum only by virtue of being one of the least vocal players?

You're telling me that pressure is completely nullified starting on Day 2? That RVS can never last for longer than a day phase (tell me, what did we learn from the Lorde lynch you pushed oh so hard?) and that, even if putting a pressure vote on a random player on Day 2 might accomplish nothing, putting it on one of the most active players in the entire game who is confirmed as town because they were saved from the nightkill by a doctor might, on any scope of reality, accomplish MORE?
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I've already explained this. My vote was currently on someone else, and I moved it to scattered as a placeholder because I didn't feel like scraping together any reason whatsoever to use as pressure on another person. No, I didn't so that pressure is nullified. I said that pressure with giving any reason is nullified. e.g. If you just voted someone out-of-the-blue, or even with some very obvious, RVS-y type of reason. Sure, that might not have been well thought through (I probably could have made something up in a minute, maybe); but ultimately all this is just you not agreeing with what I did, or just plain misinterpreting it.

This is such a ridiculous strawman, haha. Even though my case on you was rubbish to start with and I was clearly making stuff up to try and get a reaction out of you, you strawmanned it anyway. Guess it worked (what's that about pressure not working? D: )
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Yes, clearly.

If it was a strawman (and literally most of this game has been ridiculous strawmen), then maybe you should make it clearer what your case was in the first place?

Speculation about nightkills is flimsy, and not worthwhile when we have better leads. Thanks to the ridiculously stealthed, rubbish Day 1 lynch against a player who wasn't remotely scummy by any stretch of ANYONE'S imagination, it's what we're stuck with. Nightkills are the most WIFOMy entity in the world, but there is one lead from this nightkill which is very worthwhile -- your reaction to it:

Like, I'm sorry? At worst this is blatant attempted character assassination of me without use of logic (wow saving the kill was so obvious and easy) and at best it's literally just outing yourself as scum because you're putting yourself in the logic of it completely. "This was a really obvious kill choice" doesn't cut it at all.

Read This: And you know what's most interesting about this for me? Why haven't you included yourself here? You and scattered were in exactly the same position at the end of Day 1. You were 2 of the 4 most active players (probably top 3, in fact) who, up to that point, had very little suspicion cast in your directions, if any at all. You were both on the Lorde wagon, though bb had a larger part in it. I simply don't understand what this massive distinction is between you and scattered which makes scattered the obvious kill choice. Except, of course, that you're scum yourself. After all, scum don't get targeted for nightkills -- they dish them out.

This was a pretty good quality scumslip, have to say. Certainly not an obvious one.
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Except for the fact that a number of players, particularly you vocally, were saying how I am scummy and should be looked into the next day etcetera etcetera. Scum don't go around kill people others think are scummy, especially when those others are vocal and experienced like yourself. Comparitively, scattered is a highly experienced player who very little people (no one?) thought was scummy, and thus would have been the most obvious scum kill choice from a bystander perspective like myself. So duh, I did not include myself in there because I would not have considered myself a likely candidate.

Yup, that's not a scumslip.

NinjaPenguin said:
Who's my backup target?

Scattered, your "BB's slip" is just him being hypocritical. Cel has been just as hypocritical this game. As for Cel's "BB's slip", it actually has some substance. I'll wait to hear bb's response before commenting more on it.
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Celever was putting a lot of effort to pressure me about WIFOMy stuff when I posted that, and so I was basically saying he should go use that effort to pressure someone else, because again, all he said was WIFOM. I, on the other hand, couldn't be bothered to scumhunt heavily. Of course, that's not the case now - apparently he just made that WIFOM all up [to get me even more annoyed].

NinjaPenguin said:
How does that actually make bb feel pressured?
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^

@mirdo Why do you think I'm scummy?
 
That's a disappointing response, and doesn't put up a fight at all, nor give me anything to respond to. Anyone can read back and see that you were by no means even in the top half of the game in terms of scumreads (more people said the inactives as a whole are scum instead of you). A panicked response considering you're found out. Shame.
 
Celever said:
That's a disappointing response, and doesn't put up a fight at all, nor give me anything to respond to.
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Good. Fighting is tiresome, tedious and unfun, and it achieves nothing. After all, I've responded; why does it need to be taken further? The cases just become more confusing and difficult to follow, and they are generally intended solely to further evidence for a scum alignment, to twist anything and everything as scummy, and thus ultimately achieve nothing but a tunnel and false evidence. They seldom ever change anyone's opinions, and realistically, nothing I say will change your mind, unless it is something that confirms my town alignment.

Maybe you should start scumhunting others instead of tunelling me, since you don't appear to have any leads after I flip town...
 
bbninjas said:
Good. Fighting is tiresome, tedious and unfun, and it achieves nothing. After all, I've responded; why does it need to be taken further? The cases just become more confusing and difficult to follow, and they are generally intended solely to further evidence for a scum alignment, to twist anything and everything as scummy, and thus ultimately achieve nothing but a tunnel and false evidence. They seldom ever change anyone's opinions, and realistically, nothing I say will change your mind, unless it is something that confirms my town alignment.

Maybe you should start scumhunting others instead of tunelling me, since you don't appear to have any leads after I flip town...
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lol.

> Lies about what happened yesterday as a rushed and panicked response
> It's impossible to respond to a lie because it turns into "he said she said"
> When I point this out, tells me to drop the case on him completely.

It was a scumslip. Town players are constantly in fear of the nightkill and the logic that some people saw you as a little scummy, while not true, isn't even relevant because usually scum kill in order to influence discussion, which is actually furthered by this alleged accusational mood of you throughout the town.
 
Perhaps also time to start looking for Day 3 options. I might even start helping.
 
@Celever The answer I was looking for bb to say is that he differentiated himself from scattered by pushing the Lorde lynch much more than scattered (and giving us the Prof. P distraction), which could have led to trouble for him the next day.
He got somewhat close to that, so I'll at least try other avenues of pressure before voting for him.
 
NinjaPenguin said:
@Celever The answer I was looking for bb to say is that he differentiated himself from scattered by pushing the Lorde lynch much more than scattered (and giving us the Prof. P distraction), which could have led to trouble for him the next day.
He got somewhat close to that, so I'll at least try other avenues of pressure before voting for him.
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But Lorde was town, and this is something I actually mentioned in #415.

If you two want more lynch options, you should start trying to find them.
 
Celever said:
But Lorde was town, and this is something I actually mentioned in #415.

If you two want more lynch options, you should start trying to find them.
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Yes, and bb pushed a town lynch much more than scattered. Pushing a town lynch will generally lead to people seeing you as scum, making you a worse nightkill option.
 
Day 2 Vote Count 1

All votes are in chronological order
The players being voted are in alphabetical order
The player(s) with the most votes is tagged
If you think there’s anything wrong please ask

@bbninjas 2: bbninjas | Celever (vote) | mirdo (vote)
Celever 0: NinjaPenguin (vote) |
@mirdo 2: scattered mind (vote) | NinjaPenguin (vote) |
NinjaPenguin 1: Rainyman123 |
scattered mind 1: ninjapenguin | bbninjas (vote) |

The following players need to step up their activity. @PikaMasterJesi, @Ice Espeon and @Jadethepokemontrainer.

A reminder that Day 2 will end in 72 hours.
 
Except it was Day 1. If people put stock in Day 1 town lynches, they're usually scum trying to play on the emotions of the town to push lynches on town. Assuming both you and bb are town for a moment, that would make all of the vocal players this game town, so scum would have a lot of issue pushing this lynch without there being a playstyle shift. Therefore, the differentiator should be insignificant from your point of view.
 
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