PokeBeach's Official 5th Gen Ban List

RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

AlphaNinja said:
Garchomp shouldn't be banned since it can be beat. I have had a lot of time to test my views on this and with my tests I have found that 6 to 7 times out of 10 Garchomp can be out matched by Hydragon. Blaziken is lame because of Speed Boost. Ninjask has that and he isn't banned. Then again he is to frail. Blaziken can be countered easy by bulky Hazers and by pokemon that can change its ability. Even putting to sleep will ruin its odds of sweeping. Don't think for a second I haven't taken into consideration all the diffrent ways to counter these two.

Garchomp shouldn't be banned because it can be beaten, your exact words. Well Arceus shouldn't be banned because level 1 aron with endeavor can beat it in sand. If your Hydreigon is beating Garchomp you must not be facing Garchomp. You switch in Hydreigon, Garchomp Swords Dances. Now Garchomp outspeeds and uses Dragon Claw/Outrage and OHKOs your Hydreigon. That worked well. Part of the reason Garchomp is banned anyway is Sand Veil. Its already a hard Pokemon to counter and can dictate at least 1 spot of your team to stopping it. When that Pokemon misses because of Sand Veil now your entire team is dead. Sure, hax happens, but hax against a Garchomp basically guarentees a loss, and Sand Veil encourages hax. Next, I find it sad you are comparing Ninjask to Blaziken. Ninjask has base 90 attack and base 50 sp. atk. Blaziken has 120 base attack and base 110 sp. atk. Blaziken has base 120 fire STAB and base 130 Fighting STAB, two of the best attacking types in the metagame, as well as exellent back-up attacks in Earthquake and Stone Edge. Ninjask's Bug and Flying STABs are base 80 and 60 respectively, and it has no movepool for sweeping other than that. Blaziken also has decent 80/70/70 defenses while Ninjask has horrible 61/45/50 defenses and a plethora of weaknesses to common attacking types like rock, ice, electric, and fire. It also has a times 4 weakness to stealth rock, making it a poor choice as anything but a lead. Ninjask and Blaziken are as different as you can get, with the only similarities being their abilities. That's like saying that Aerodactyl and Dialga both have pressure as an ability and aerodactyl isn't that good so Dialga obviously isn't very good either. Next is your statement that bulky Hazers can counter Blaziken. The only bulky Hazer is Vaporeon, and it doesn't appreciate taking +2 STAB High Jump Kicks. I'm not going to run the calcs but its obviously a 2HKO on even the most physically defensive Vaporeon, and maybe an OHKO on some. Also, Vaporeon basically does nothing to anything meta except Blaziken, so you are spending a slot on your team to counter it. The same thing goes for Suicune, the best bulky phazer. Pokemon that change its ability...I'm not even going to answer this. If you can't find out why a Pokemon that is outsped and 2HKOed by Blaziken while only preventing it from getting speed boosts (which it can get when it switches out and back in again) is not a good idea then try thinking again. Also, every single Pokemon that can learn a sleep move is outsped and OHKOed by a Blaziken after a single turn.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

While the metagame does prove to be a challenge I find it a waste of time. Time spent creating tiers and so on could be better used trying to find a better way to handle the pokemon. Even team building is becomming to complex. Pokemon in my opinion is ment to be fun not competitive.
Okay, so...let's assume for the sake of argument, we bring back Blaziken. And let's say you're fighting someone and he leads with Blaziken. He uses Protect to get his free Speed Boost, then just sets up one SD and starts crashing into things. And by the time that Blaziken's got 2 or 3 Speed Boosts set up, it'll take something crazy like SDJet Empoleon with a Sash to kill it. But even then, Blaziken's killed 1 or 2 things of yours and severely dented another one. And the other guy still has 5 Pokemon left to your 3.

I don't know about you, but getting wrecked to pieces by a kung-fu chicken every other fight does not constitute my idea of 'fun'. Blaziken and Garchomp got banned because, in a regular OU environment, they are just way too dangerous. They both rip things to shreds, and Garchomp does not really have a true counter.

Remember, a counter is something that can safely switch into a Pokemon and threaten it back. Nothing can really safely switch in to Garchomp under normal conditions - especially not under Sand Veil.

I don't go hard-core competitive - I play for fun above else but I also try to win. And even someone as inexperienced as myself can see, AlphaNinja, that your arguments don't really hold water.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Ahahahahaha.

Is this some kinda of joke? Unban Garchomp and Blaziken?
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

hey guys i don have a problem with blaziken becuz i run CB Azumarril aqua jet and CB Dnite espeed on my team please unban kthxbai

You do know that a counter is a Pokemon that can safely switch in and threaten back, right AlphaNinja? Jellicent and Slowbro, the very few defensive Pokemon that resists Blaziken's STABs, get wrecked by a +2 Stone Edge. Skarmory and Bronzong, the only Pokemon that can resist Chomp's STABs, only work 80% of the time because of Sand Veil.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

TheDarkLucario said:
hey guys i don have a problem with blaziken becuz i run CB Azumarril aqua jet and CB Dnite espeed on my team please unban kthxbai

You do know that a counter is a Pokemon that can safely switch in and threaten back, right AlphaNinja? Jellicent and Slowbro, the very few defensive Pokemon that resists Blaziken's STABs, get wrecked by a +2 Stone Edge. Skarmory and Bronzong, the only Pokemon that can resist Chomp's STABs, only work 80% of the time because of Sand Veil.

seriously. Conversation over. They stay banned. Go cry or something, or do whatever you do to relieve yourself of stress. Now, for the next topic. Stunfisk is too good for OU, i think it should be banned. Same with excadrill, scizor, tyranitar, politoed, ninetails, and pikachu. Ban em all. Discuss.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

^Your doin that just because I have most of them on my team...
*Glares at the Assassin*
Stunkfish
Yes, ban him, he is way too good for OU.

Excadrill
No, that would ruin my team counters. He isn't very good, with like 5 counters in OU, and I have noticed some in UU, and NU. He isn't that great enough to be banned.

Scizor
This would destroy my team, and many other peoples team, he is just way over used, no need in banning him, just cause people like him.

Tyranitar
go ahead, doesn't hurt much of us, unless we run sand teams, then it kills us off.

politoed
No, he is a main for RD teams, and that would just ruin the metagame. People on PB would either have to get a new team, or just quit in general. I think just becuase some guys are overused, and that means better movesets, and better strategies... what is this... just because guys are good, doesn't mean we should ban them.

Ninetales
I think this is a legit ban, but I don't think this will help our members with sunny day teams. I don't see him often, and I don't consider him OU, I think he is more of like UU.

Pikachu
You just can't ban the Pokemon Icon... That would look great, a Pokemon sight, that bans Pikachu from use.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Blaziken and Garchomp ruin the metagame. The reason they are banned is because they both have very few counters and distort the balance of the game. I think someone mentioned Jirachi. It's incredibly annoying and trollish, but it has several counters, namely Excadrill, Landorus, pretty much anything faster than it or priority. Conkeldurr with Guts+Bulk Up completely destroys Jirachi too.

Blaziken=broken

Garchomp=trolling broken
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

No one here is providing valuable new input, it is just people shooting down people's idea because they don't know what they are talking about. Now, I'm not very good at the Video Games, but we should just go by the ban list we already have, it works fine. I don't see why this is still open.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Nothing slower than Jirachi can counter Jirachi. Conkeldurr can bulk up all he wants but when you flinch 7 times in a row followed up with a hearty few rounds of full paralysis you ain't killing no one.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

^That is true, but I Conkeldurr, can cause massive damage, and then when he faints, you can just use a simple guy, and then boom! Jirachi faints...
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

That doesn't exactly qualify as a Jirachi counter. As for the others?

Just so long as we are cool with banning any auto-weather ability all at once, I'm all for it :D
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Well.... actually, Conkeldurr is okay against Haxrachi. At +2 Defence, Conkeldurr won't be taking too much damage, and he will just recover the damage with Drain Punch when it hits. Then there's the Guts boost to think about.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

You're almost better off using Mach Punch against Jirachi once you have 1-2 Bulk Ups just so you don't flinch.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

I agree with DE here. With those boosts Conkeldurr can be a great way to counter some threats. One inparticular Tyranitar who holds current OU as the highest base physical attack Dark-type. Any well placed Fighting attack will OHKO it. Stunfisk isn't that great in my opinion. Unless it has an Air Balloon to block Ground attacks it's basically bait to strong Special base or Physical base attacks. The only thing it's immune to is Electric-type attacks thanks to it's typeing. Grass, Water, Ground and Ice are all super effective against it. That makes it an easy pokemon to counter with such low speed.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

If Tyranitar is OHKOed by any fighting move, then why does Conkeldurr need boosts to counter it? It doesn't. Also, how is that related to the potential of banning Jirachi...? Also, stunfisk was obviously sarcasm, eveyone and their mother knows it's not good competitively.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

The Spooky Manor Dream World area was released today, so the following Pokemon + Ability combinations (and the evolutions) are now legal.

Unnerve Meowth
Magic Guard Abra
Inner Focus Drowzee
Technician Mr. Mime
Sniper Spinarak
Telepathy Wobbuffet
Rattled Snubbull
Unnerve Houndour
Telepathy Ralts
Prankster Sableye
Sheer Force Mawile
Telepathy Meditite
Prankster Volbeat
Prankster Illumise
Gluttony Spoink
Cursed Body Shuppet
Keen Eye Stunky
Heavy Metal Bronzor
Infiltrator Spiritomb
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Interesting, at least we didn't get DW Litwick. Anyway, are we going to consider banning Prankster Sableye? Its really the only good thing that was released, and in all the games I've played with it it has been quite good. Probably not Ubers though, but OU at least.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Sableye will probably be OU. With Prankster+Will-O-Wisp+whatever else it is an excellent Gliscor counter (granted they don't have Protect). Not to mention Pokemon like Excadrill and Terrakion suffer, no matter how high their speed is.
 
RE: PokeBeach's Official Ban List

Thanks for the list. The first post has been updated.

Edit Prankster Sableye is not uber. He's a jerk to face, but he is only good at checking physical threats. Anything that doesn't care about/is immune to receiving a burn is going to grind Sableye and his no-defenses into dust.

Torment variants might cause some problems, though.
 
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