Will sp pokemon take over?
- Thread starter PokeKid Brandon
- Start date
I have not seen even one ToxiTank deck in this deck garage that runs Pluspower. Futhermore, to use 2-3 PokeTurns for your Crobat G and not your Toxicroak G really makes me wonder if you are playing catch up or trying to desperately get ahead. Also, we can't forget the bench space Stuntank G, Crobat G, and Uxie/Claydol take up. You run Buck's in a ToxiTank deck? Good luck.PokeChamp said:
And I have no issues in constantly getting out four Rampardos in six turns. If that wasn't the case, I wouldn't be playing the deck.
Honestly, ToxiTank is certainly not the best SP deck there is, so I wonder where the point of arguing this point even is.
However, Zyflair, Toxitank is still a good deck, and is the best SP deck in DP-PT. Though in DP-BET, and especially DP-PoTF, we get a lot better SP decks.
Also, Mewtwo LV. X is not a counter to any SP decks that have a Dialga G LV. X.
Also, Mewtwo LV. X is not a counter to any SP decks that have a Dialga G LV. X.
In machamp I tech in mewtwo lv.x so if they want to attack they must use dialga g lv.x but if they do than toxicroaks body gets shut off and then I send up machamp and take out ko.
Ok you meanie! Thanks I had not realized that so there goes that stratgy.
I believe this thread is intended to discuss about all the current SP Pokemon released in the world. ToxiTank is far from excellent compared to the PoTF and BET ones, indeed, so I'm not sure why I'm arguing if ToxiTank is any good.Blue Thunder said:
Actually, I could see a Flygon BET/Mewtwo LA as a deck to counter SP Pokemon. Flygon LV.X easily destroys Dialga G LV.X and Mewtwo LV.X will just sweep. The setup time is pretty bad, though.
Zyflair said:
Flygon could actually be considered as a metagame counter.
And, I would like to make a small point about setup. Trapinch start. Attach an energy to Trapinch. Use some method of discarding cards from your hand to put 1 {F} energy in the discard, then have Trapinch recover it. Next turn, RC into Flygon, attach energy, Power Swing.
In certain situations, it can be fast.
Zyflair said:
Oh, I guess you got me there...
Well, if you have anyway of stopping Dialga G, then Mewtwo could work, and Flygon does that quite well. However, I don't care if there is a counter to SPs. Some of the greatest decks out there still have counters. SPs will still be a big chunk of the meta once the 09-10 season starts.
Eh, I'm not sure which side I'm on anymore.
Hello everyone, glad to see such a large discussion. I would just like to voice my opinion on the Toxitank deck. Now I have never played any other SP deck but I do know Toxitank is very good.
People believe it is hard to get all the pieces, but not really. In the 15 times I tested it I got a fully loaded Toxicroak a stadium and Skuntank turn one 11 times, turn two 2 times, and later then turn three once.
With a cyrus's conspiracy you can grab energy gain, an energy, and a roseanne's- all you need, or if you already have the pokemon you can grab another cyrus's and use it next turn to grab another and a poke turn, keeping your toxicroak bouncing back to your hand over the next 3 turns. Believe me, it's easy.
Now people say Machamp can get an easy win, in my deck I tech in a lake boundary for the 1 hit KO. Against rampardos I use one of my three snowpoint temples, I hit him for 60 +10, he swings for 80, I use poketurn (always have an extra toxicroak) and attack for an additional 60, me 1 rampardos 0. Now you can argue that the odds of a poketurn are slim, not really. I run 4 then 4 Cyrus's so I can grab one every turn.
I guess I'll bring up power spray, no Uxie, Azelf, Gliscor Lv.X, Claydol, Delcatty, Blastoise, Drapion Lv.X, etc. It completely stops Blastcatty.
I will acknowledge your point on Mewtwo Lv.X, yes Toxitank does have Dialga G lv.X, but it's not the perfect plan- A) I have to get it active to level up B) it's difficult to find it and the Lv.X in such a combo deck C) retreating it once it's active. I'm actually thinking of putting a mewtwo Lv.x into Toxitank for the mirror match (which is horrible because skuntank G can't poison G). I guess Toxicroak will just have to donk before Mewtwo Lv.X hits the field.
Well thank you for reading my argument, I may not agree with what you say but I will defend your right to say it.
People believe it is hard to get all the pieces, but not really. In the 15 times I tested it I got a fully loaded Toxicroak a stadium and Skuntank turn one 11 times, turn two 2 times, and later then turn three once.
With a cyrus's conspiracy you can grab energy gain, an energy, and a roseanne's- all you need, or if you already have the pokemon you can grab another cyrus's and use it next turn to grab another and a poke turn, keeping your toxicroak bouncing back to your hand over the next 3 turns. Believe me, it's easy.
Now people say Machamp can get an easy win, in my deck I tech in a lake boundary for the 1 hit KO. Against rampardos I use one of my three snowpoint temples, I hit him for 60 +10, he swings for 80, I use poketurn (always have an extra toxicroak) and attack for an additional 60, me 1 rampardos 0. Now you can argue that the odds of a poketurn are slim, not really. I run 4 then 4 Cyrus's so I can grab one every turn.
I guess I'll bring up power spray, no Uxie, Azelf, Gliscor Lv.X, Claydol, Delcatty, Blastoise, Drapion Lv.X, etc. It completely stops Blastcatty.
I will acknowledge your point on Mewtwo Lv.X, yes Toxitank does have Dialga G lv.X, but it's not the perfect plan- A) I have to get it active to level up B) it's difficult to find it and the Lv.X in such a combo deck C) retreating it once it's active. I'm actually thinking of putting a mewtwo Lv.x into Toxitank for the mirror match (which is horrible because skuntank G can't poison G). I guess Toxicroak will just have to donk before Mewtwo Lv.X hits the field.
Well thank you for reading my argument, I may not agree with what you say but I will defend your right to say it.
Quoting old philosophers are we?
Your flaw with the Cyrus and Roseanne's is that you just can't simply play both on the first turn. Oh sure, I see it's possible you only need one of the two to get that T1, but come on.
And again with the Rampardos vs ToxiTank argument, I don't care if your ToxiCroak G has 90 or 110 hp. I play quite a high amount of extra damaging cards (lets face it. 80 damage only is horrible, considering you also have the backlash) to OHKO those ToxiCroak. Oh, and note that you can revive all the Croaks, but your Energy Gains will go down one by one. The point of Rampardos is to OHKO and nothing else. PokeTurn is useless against it.
Your flaw with the Cyrus and Roseanne's is that you just can't simply play both on the first turn. Oh sure, I see it's possible you only need one of the two to get that T1, but come on.
And again with the Rampardos vs ToxiTank argument, I don't care if your ToxiCroak G has 90 or 110 hp. I play quite a high amount of extra damaging cards (lets face it. 80 damage only is horrible, considering you also have the backlash) to OHKO those ToxiCroak. Oh, and note that you can revive all the Croaks, but your Energy Gains will go down one by one. The point of Rampardos is to OHKO and nothing else. PokeTurn is useless against it.
You mean, you don't care if you have to spend an extra two PPs/Buck's/Crobat G? Heh, if you keep burning through them like that, you're going to run out and start 2HKOing. Once Rampy starts 2HKOing, Toxitank could start to come back.
Who says that you will have 3 SP pokemon out at the time, and that you actually have powerspray? There will be at most 1/15 of your deck is PowerSpray. Now, that doesn't give you good odds of getting it out fast enough, or meeting the Requirements. And I believe good Rampardos decks run a little more than Uxie for drawpower. >.>
Yes, I did read that.
Decks that rely on Uxie will get hurt when playing against and SP-Deck. The moment you slap down Uxie, I play Power-Spray, and congratulations, you have wasted a Bench space.
Fallen One: You forget that you have Cyrus to search them out. Suddenly that 1/20 (most lists only play 3) becomes a about 1/9.
Good Rampdaros lists do use 1-1 Claydol, though.
Decks that rely on Uxie will get hurt when playing against and SP-Deck. The moment you slap down Uxie, I play Power-Spray, and congratulations, you have wasted a Bench space.
Fallen One: You forget that you have Cyrus to search them out. Suddenly that 1/20 (most lists only play 3) becomes a about 1/9.
Good Rampdaros lists do use 1-1 Claydol, though.
The Fallen One said:
Unown R, how scary. One card, I never thought that I would ever see such amazing drawpower!
Two words: Roseanne's Research
Four in every deck. Chances are you will get them in the first hand. If not, thet can be obtsined through Poke Drawer +, and Pokedex.
Blue Thunder said:
Ohkay, I did forget that.
PokeChamp said:
Side note: I don't know exactly what your true opinion is...first you flame Rampardos haters, then you flame Rampardos to defend ToxiTank. ._.
And you'd be surprised what a cycle of Unown Rs can get you. And 4 in the deck is still the 1/15 of the deck. And...I haven't seen a list that uses Poke Drawer, could you point one out? kthx
What? What are even the chances of you having 3 SP Pokemon out and a PokeTurn in your hand when I drop the Uxie T1!? Lemme tell you, it's very unlikely.PokeChamp said:
I am very aware that I can only OHKO the first or second time, but what does it matter to me? Two of your Energy Gains have already been destroyed, and I even have enough time to pssoibly charge an Uxie LV.X if you desperately play catch up.
EDIT: How can ToxiTank start to come back anyway? As long as I can get another Rampardos out (which I always do), it's going to be nothing but a prize trade-off.
They can use Poke-Turn, so right after you hit for 80HP, you just blew a turn of attacking. It can then use that as an extra turn to get the prize trade-off a little more in their favor. The most Poke-Turn they use, the more the prize trade-off goes in their favor.